Lower ball joint boot

Moderators: theelanman, Sy V, Elanlover, muley, Enright, GeoffSmith, algirdas, nitroman, clemo, dapinky, Dave Eds, Specky, Nige, DaveT

Lower ball joint boot

Postby mikecg » Thu 02.02.2017, 20:15

I have already put this under suspension and brakes which is probably the wrong place so hopefully you will not all answer twice :D

Hi is there a relatively easy way to replace the boot on the lower ball joint? I have one that is badly weathered and cracking and have found a boot that I believe will fit.
Additionally I cannot see anywhere in the workshop manual how to replace the lower ball joint which I imagine is no small feat?
Anybody got instructions that I can keep for future use?

Thanks, Mike
User avatar
mikecg
Newbie
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue 29.12.2015, 15:11
Location: Horley, Surrey

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby dapinky » Thu 02.02.2017, 20:27

Mike,

To change the whole ball joint you need to take the whole arm off the car and get the old one pressed out, and the new one pressed in - it isn't a difficult job, but it does require a very good press as it is an interference fit - you wouldn't want it coming apart whilst driving!

However, the good news is that the rubber boot is easy to change :D

Obviously, you need to undo the balljoint from the hub (can be awkward, but not impossible - due to the nut being recessed into the cast hub assembly - I find that an open-ended spanner is the easiest way as there is little room for a socket.

Once it is undone, seperating the joint from the hub requires a ball-joint splitter - either a 'proper' forked wedge, or just a cold chisel will do - you don't have to worry about preserving the rubber!

The old boot will be held with a couple of wire rings, which will pull off. Clean it up a bit, add more grease if required, and slip the new boot on with its fittings.

I use these ones - perfect fit.
Dave

Just the one now, but this one's mine! - and it will be finished eventually.....

go on - click this link - you know you want to!
User avatar
dapinky
Moderator
 
Posts: 7665
Joined: Sun 15.10.2006, 12:54
Location: As far west as you can get in West Wales before you become Irish (Pembroke Dock).

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby mikecg » Fri 03.02.2017, 18:48

Thanks Mate, I will change just the boot for the moment (as passed the MOT just a few months ago) after I complete the Cam Belt and water pump change which I am mentally preparing myself for. I have read all of the extremely good article's and watched the You Tube video and have spent the past week spraying WD40 onto the Crank Pully nut and the Right hand engine bracket bolts in the hope that it may make the task a tad easier. Only time will tell :(
User avatar
mikecg
Newbie
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue 29.12.2015, 15:11
Location: Horley, Surrey

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby Simon_P » Fri 03.02.2017, 19:09

... and the alternator bolts, pas pump bolts, and not forgetting the lower cover screws.
Simon_P
God
 
Posts: 850
Joined: Fri 06.08.2004, 12:33
Location: St Albans UK

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby mikecg » Fri 03.02.2017, 19:37

Cheers Simon a good call :D
User avatar
mikecg
Newbie
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue 29.12.2015, 15:11
Location: Horley, Surrey

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby lotusflasherman » Sat 04.02.2017, 02:57

mikecg wrote:Thanks Mate, I will change just the boot for the moment (as passed the MOT just a few months ago) after I complete the Cam Belt and water pump change which I am mentally preparing myself for. I have read all of the extremely good article's and watched the You Tube video and have spent the past week spraying WD40 onto the Crank Pully nut and the Right hand engine bracket bolts in the hope that it may make the task a tad easier. Only time will tell :(


Make sure you use the right WD40 :lol: WD40 Multi Use Product was hyped up to be a complete panacea but there was lots of evidence from independent tests, some on Youtube, that WD40 doesn't compare to a penetrating oil such as Plus Gas for releasing seized threads. WD40 have responded and introduced their own penetrating oil - WD40 penetrating-oil-specialist-fast-release-penetrant-250ml Seems to be an admission that "Multi Use" wasn't quite doing what they claimed it would, but I'll still buy Plus Gas as 400ml is similar price to 250ml of WD40 Fast Release.
Phil

Leave me alone, I think I know what I'm doing.
Cars: Subaru Forester 2.5XTN, Eclat Riviera & brace of Pacific Blue SE's.... and now an Elan+2S !
User avatar
lotusflasherman
God
 
Posts: 1830
Joined: Fri 05.09.2008, 00:14
Location: Hadleigh, 15m west of Ipswich or 800 miles south (Cap d'Agde)

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby lotusflasherman » Sat 04.02.2017, 03:54

Mike,

Upper & Lower ball joint nuts are 19mm M12x1.5 and should be tightened to 45 to 49 lbf.ft so expect them to be tight. As Dave says, access to the lower one is restricted so he uses an open ended spanner, but he's bigger than me. :lol:

I use a 3/8 square drive '19mm crowsfoot' on an extending handle to undo it and it also means I can torque it up when refitting. Set is £14 to £17 on ebay and very useful. Much better on brake pipe unions than an open ended as well.

sockets.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Phil

Leave me alone, I think I know what I'm doing.
Cars: Subaru Forester 2.5XTN, Eclat Riviera & brace of Pacific Blue SE's.... and now an Elan+2S !
User avatar
lotusflasherman
God
 
Posts: 1830
Joined: Fri 05.09.2008, 00:14
Location: Hadleigh, 15m west of Ipswich or 800 miles south (Cap d'Agde)

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby dapinky » Sat 04.02.2017, 09:48

lotusflasherman wrote:I use a 3/8 square drive '19mm crowsfoot' on an extending handle to undo it and it also means I can torque it up when refitting. Set is £14 to £17 on ebay and very useful. Much better on brake pipe unions than an open ended as well.


3 comments for this.....

(1) a crowsfoot may not sit far enough onto the nut - but if you have one, it's worth using....

(2) probably makes so little difference that it isn't worth worrying about for this application, but by using a crowsfoot 'extension' on a torque wrench the settings will be wrong as the rotational pivot is shifted by the distance between the centre of the square hole and the centre of the nut, so the turning force will be different at the 2 points.

(3) they are good for many awkward bolts on the elan - brake master cylinder removal for one...


Oh, and one more thought - the way the hub swivels changes the access to the bottom nut - there is more of it exposed from the rear of the car due to the angle of the metal casting, so a spanner from the back may give better purchase than from the front..... and to get even more, you can undo the track rod end and push the front edge further inwards........ but you may then disturb/damage the rubber on that joint and need to change that one aswell :o
Dave

Just the one now, but this one's mine! - and it will be finished eventually.....

go on - click this link - you know you want to!
User avatar
dapinky
Moderator
 
Posts: 7665
Joined: Sun 15.10.2006, 12:54
Location: As far west as you can get in West Wales before you become Irish (Pembroke Dock).

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby lotusflasherman » Sat 04.02.2017, 16:17

dapinky wrote:
lotusflasherman wrote:I use a 3/8 square drive '19mm crowsfoot' on an extending handle to undo it and it also means I can torque it up when refitting. Set is £14 to £17 on ebay and very useful. Much better on brake pipe unions than an open ended as well.


3 comments for this .....

(1) a crowsfoot may not sit far enough onto the nut - but if you have one, it's worth using....

(2) probably makes so little difference that it isn't worth worrying about for this application, but by using a crowsfoot 'extension' on a torque wrench the settings will be wrong as the rotational pivot is shifted by the distance between the centre of the square hole and the centre of the nut, so the turning force will be different at the 2 points.

(3) they are good for many awkward bolts on the elan - brake master cylinder removal for one...


Oh, and one more thought - the way the hub swivels changes the access to the bottom nut - there is more of it exposed from the rear of the car due to the angle of the metal casting, so a spanner from the back may give better purchase than from the front..... and to get even more, you can undo the track rod end and push the front edge further inwards........ but you may then disturb/damage the rubber on that joint and need to change that one aswell :o


3 replies for this Dave ...

1) some crowsfoot are just open-ended with a variable length lever though I prefer the slightly superior version that traps 5 of the hex points. If an open ended fits I'd be surprised if a crowsfoot wouldn't but on mine there is an offset where the drive fits in the square hole. The set I have sit properly on the lower balljoint nut when the hub is turned slightly.

2) Agree with your theory, that was a concern to me too. There are special torque wrenches that take special crowsfoot inserts but are 'silly money' so I when I first wanted to torque up using crowsfoot I held my standard 1/2 square torque wrench set to 47 lbf.ft in a vice and a 19mm socket with a couple of nuts in it so enough protruded for the crowsfoot to get on it. I then adjusted my 3/8 drive torque wrench so they both 'click' together. Torque wrench has a ratchet head so crowsfoot can stick straight out, be at +90°, or 180°back on itself. There is a difference in leverage for each and one wrench will click just before the other but the difference in setting and extra force needed for the second click is very marginal. As the graduations on the the 3/8 drive wrench are so small I still find it easier to set it against the 1/2 drive wrench where I can at least read the graduations with spectacles - the 3/8 needs a magnifying glass too!

Bought my latest SE with a new MOT and did about 1,600 miles without problems but on the way to my first MOT it felt a bit weird and MOT guy found NSF lower ball joint nut loose and pin moving about in hole. (No wonder it started feeling weird!). He pushed it back and tightened it up with an open ended but considered the nyloc insert wasn't 'fit for purpose' as it wasn't doing much so gave me a fail on that to go with 'a sticky caliper' fail. I'm sure if had been torqued up properly it wouldn't have come loose as it shouldn't rely on the nyloc insert. Found it easy to get M12x1.75 nylocks but M12x1.5* took a bit of searching for but having got some I replaced the 'failed nut', which was coming loose again, and decided to do the other side too. Glad I did because that nut was far too easy to undo. The NSF pin suffered some scuffing when moving about so I'm a bit particular about not letting that happen again and a crowsfoot on a torque wrench is the only way I can find to torque up those nuts and have absolute confidence it's within limits.

(* Note for other readers - Wheel bolts are M12x1.5 threads so if you don't have a thread gauge you can use a wheel bolt to check for correct thread for a replacement lower ball joint nut. The nut should spin on easily up to the nylon insert, a nut with 1.75 thread will tighten before even 1/2 a turn is achieved. I did order some 1.5's from a Lotus dealer but they sent 1.75's ! )

3) Quite a lot of awkward bolts on the Elan, but much easier with the right tools, very difficult without them. Get very annoyed when I can't find what I need, particularly when son has borrowed them and returned set with critical bit missing .. :banghead:
Phil

Leave me alone, I think I know what I'm doing.
Cars: Subaru Forester 2.5XTN, Eclat Riviera & brace of Pacific Blue SE's.... and now an Elan+2S !
User avatar
lotusflasherman
God
 
Posts: 1830
Joined: Fri 05.09.2008, 00:14
Location: Hadleigh, 15m west of Ipswich or 800 miles south (Cap d'Agde)

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby dapinky » Sat 04.02.2017, 17:30

Phil,

I can't find anything in the above to arge with.... and certainly the difference in torque with or without a crowsfoot will still be more accurate than using an openended spanner and 'guessing' it.
Dave

Just the one now, but this one's mine! - and it will be finished eventually.....

go on - click this link - you know you want to!
User avatar
dapinky
Moderator
 
Posts: 7665
Joined: Sun 15.10.2006, 12:54
Location: As far west as you can get in West Wales before you become Irish (Pembroke Dock).

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby mikecg » Sat 04.02.2017, 19:00

Thanks guys for the wealth of great information and experience. How can I fail ? :o
User avatar
mikecg
Newbie
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue 29.12.2015, 15:11
Location: Horley, Surrey

Re: Lower ball joint boot

Postby mikecg » Wed 08.03.2017, 18:16

All completed, worryingly the nut came undone too easily so have made sure it tighter. I will the other side before I put it back on the road. As indicated by you guys once the nut was undone it was a piece of cake. So with that done and the replacement water pump and cam belt fitted it is now down to applying a little TLC to the car before it comes out for the news season in a few weeks time. :-D
User avatar
mikecg
Newbie
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue 29.12.2015, 15:11
Location: Horley, Surrey


Return to Chassis & Steering

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests