Replacing Radiator

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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Mon 25.07.2016, 20:49

Hello All,

If you have not got this, Download it, lots of useful information.

For those that are interested "Cooling System" Section KD on pages 431 to 440 shows Federal and Standard radiator frame and fittings.


frank.villaro-dixon.eu/public_upload/Elan-M100-Service-Manual-v2.pdf


Steve 8)
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Mon 25.07.2016, 23:03

Steve: That is V.2 of the manual. There is a V.6 available as well.

ALL of the available digital manuals can be found at www.lotusm100.com/manuals of by clicking the links at the bottom of surfboardfiller, and my posts.
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Tue 26.07.2016, 07:36

Brit-Car-Nut wrote:Steve: That is V.2 of the manual. There is a V.6 available as well.

ALL of the available digital manuals can be found at http://www.lotusm100.com/manuals of by clicking the links at the bottom of surfboardfiller, and my posts.


Thanks Brit Car Nut, I will give this a good study.
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Tue 26.07.2016, 15:44

TimothyHays wrote:This is Tim, the guy with the problem car. I have already removed what some refer to as foam inserts, but I call rubber grommets. Yes, it has airbags & A/C. I will try to take good pictures when I get together with the radiator specialist here in La Jolla, at Bud's Radiator, but I have to get the car flatbed-towed from the current repair place over to Bud's. Yes, we removed the frame from the car as there is no way of fitting the new radiator while leaving the frame in place at Steve mentioned. The frame and both the new and old radiator is at Bud's and they saw right away the problem with the new radiator which won't fit down into the frame with the primary problem being the ends. The new radiator is somewhat blocky and the original radiator is rounded/beveled and fits further down into the base-frame/bracket and the new radiator sits up higher.

-Tim


Hello Tim,

A picture tell a thousand words!!!!!! If you check out the user's manual page I have attached you will find a drawing that shows 1.5" between the radiator tank and the condenser support bracket. I suspect that befor you owned the car that the front end has been kerbed and bent the bracket up by a fair amount. With this pulled back down your fitting problems should be history. Sounds if Steve Mathers Mystic powers have identified the root cause without seeing the car.

Regards

Steve.


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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Simon_P » Wed 27.07.2016, 00:31

Hi Steve,

The pictures are tiny - Could you post bigger ones?

Thanks,
Simon
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Wed 27.07.2016, 03:57

I have resized the pictures to fit the LEC requirements.

I have also compared his pictures to the Radiator/Condenser assembly I have and his lower frame is NOT bent or damaged.

The "C" channel that runs across the bottom of the radiator fouls the frame and prevents the radiator from leaning far enough backward.
See picture # 3. Shouldn't that piece have the flanges facing UP?

Tim H. tried removing the lower rubber bushings to give the pins more room to float, but that doesn't work either.

When his mechanic put the radiator in place and pushed the top pins into the frame, the bottom frame doesn't fit up to the radiator enough to secure the condenser.

They don't appear to have done anything wrong, so far.

Why are the side tanks so much larger (width and thickness) than the original radiators?

Steve M.: Can you post a picture of the Passenger Side lower corner of your radiator and how you mounted it? I am using YOUR car #1 original radiator assembly to compare.

If he wasn't so far away, Tim could get me the radiator and I could try installing it on the test chassis, but the shipping would be a lot of wasted money.

DSC08822-r.jpg

DSC08824-r.jpg

DSC08843-r.jpg

DSC08844-r.jpg

Shop Manual Picture.jpg

This drawing is a bit out of proportion. Most likely to clearly show where everything goes. The clearance between the radiator and condenser is really only around 3/8 inch.
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Wed 27.07.2016, 09:34

Hello all,
This thread is beginning to look like a volume from The War and Piece book. I know we have spoken before Brit Car Nut, have you purchased an aluminium radiator? We have sold around 40 units into the USA alone over the last 12 Months and this is the first won't fit comment We have had. There are 2 USA guys on this thread that have had no problems fitting the radiator. The aluminium tanks are TIG welded and the tanks can't be reduced in size without narrowing the core. Steve Mathers has said on this thread that he had no problem fitting his radiator last week and no doubt there are other members reading the thread that have fitted the radiator without problem, so I am at a loss to understand why this one has a problem. I am producing a radiator with an inverted bottom bracket and cutting the tanks and and chamfering them back ito miss the condenser brackets. We will then send it fast courier across to Tim. I would like Tim to send this radiator to Steve Mathers in Virginia for me, to see if we need to make a permenent modification to Federal M100 radiators.
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby steve matthews » Wed 27.07.2016, 12:48

Pictures show the wrong side. The bottom. fixing bar (round piece) is protruding upward. This should not be.
Remove the plastic piece from Btm. frame. You may have to bend the round fixing bar downward then upward like the diagram.

Steve - Let's see the engine side :poke:

In picture #3 I do not believe radiator is to go between brackits.
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Tue 02.08.2016, 14:46

Hello All,

After selling many of these radiator to the USA in the past it would seem that the buyers have to bend and modify the Federal bracket arrangement to get the radiator to fit. We have looked into the difference and it would seem to be the condenser mounting brackets are not allowing the radiator to tilt causing the radiator to stand up above the lower mounting bolt pins. We have now sloped the bottom of the radiator tank to miss the condenser bracket and as an added precaution inverted and welded up the lower rail where the supporting rods run under the radiator. As was mentioned in the previous post, the radiator does not have to fit between the condenser brackets but behind them.

Tim has received his radiator in San Diego CA and we await the confirmation that he has fitted it.

Steve. 8)

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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby Coolexperts » Sat 04.03.2017, 12:01

E3 second updated .pdf

Hello All,

Please find the drawing of our modified radiator that now addresses all of the issues inherited by us with
the Boston model.
The tanks have been shaped and steps fitted to the pegs to cure the problems that were arising with the
Federal Model fouling the aircon condenser when fitted.
The lower radiator rail has been radiused front and back to clear the towing bar bracket on the U.K. and
the rest of the world models.
the diameter length and position of the top and bottom pins now matches those on the original radiator
A big vote of thanks is given to all the members who had an input on the radiator adjustments, especially
"Brit car Nut" for the R&D work that he carried out.

Regards

Steve 8)
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Re: Replacing Radiator

Postby peteoddcar » Sun 23.04.2017, 07:46

Just to add that I fitted a Coolex rad a couple of weeks back I had no issues with the fit on my early SE.
I did have it painted black by Coolex which I think is worthwhile.
The biggest faff was the undertray bolts - resorted to angle grinder to take the heads off in the end.
Once the bracket was on the bench I got all the rusted studs out with the aid of a blow torch and a pair of molegrips.
I did have the support bracket and towing shot blasted which revealed a very rusty towing eye which I needed to weld new metal too. Painted the lot with "tough black".
I do recall the upper grommets slipped out whilst fitting the rad so I dropped it all down again cleaned the grommets and area around the hole and put them back in the holes then with a long screw driver put a few drops of Bostik clear glue around the edges - went and had a cuppa and a ham and tomato sandwich ( you could substitute a different filling at this point) put a smear of grease on the pegs and the rad slipped in perfectly.
Would have been easier had the car been on a lift but I managed.
Put the undertray on with new stainless steel hardware and replace the rubber on the splitter with a £9 eBay job and it's looking fine.
The car runs slightly cooler than before which I don't really understand so suspecting a stuck open thermostat.
I have 300 or so miles no coolant level change and heater etc working fine.
It's like most jobs on M100 - it will take longer than it should but if you allow a few days to cater for the inevitable project creep then alls fine. If I needed to drop it out now for any reason it would be a quick job as everything is new hardware, and all assemble with a smear of anti seize grease.
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