Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

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Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Mon 03.11.2014, 21:53

After a fair bit of experimentation with different donor seals I have come to the decision that the best one for the job is from a Mitsubishi FTO. Modifying this one to fit the Elan is the easiest of all the ones I have tried, ( all have been from Japanese cars and they all had similarities of design which leads me to think they are all made by the same company) in saying that though its not a simple job but anyone that is reasonably competent with their hands should manage it, the hard part is shaping the end that fits above the door latch, its not massively difficult but it requires a good bit of patience and the ability to work things out as you go along.

The seal at the end has a thin metal insert and this can be bent to the shape required for the Elan, but it also needs cut and some bits of rubber from the underside thinned down, however if you can make this part then the job is done because the rest of it is simple, once the modded part is fitted it is just a matter of pinning the rest of the seal to the door, some holes will need drilled in the seal for the plastic studs as some will be out of alignment with the holes on your door but that's easy enough, then when you reach the end at the mirror its just a matter of cutting a small section from the underside of the seal in order to make a flat part. At this bit on the original seal it has a thick part that fills the gap where you get access to one of the mirror screws, all that is required there is fill the gap with some Black-tac and mold it to shape, this will prevent any water from entering round the edge of the seal. And basically that's the job done. :D

This picture shows how I have shaped it to fit the setup on mine which is not OEM, but the next picture down shows one that I have replicated the original seal which overhangs the weatherstrip.
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Notice I have made a channel so that water coming down onto the seal sends it down the edge and not into the gap where the glass sits, there is also a thin bit of rubber which touches the very edge of the window.
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On this one if it was an OEM weather strip you would make it cover it down to the paintwork almost, these are Honda weatherstrips which are a bit more heavy duty.
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Here you can see the side of the seal near the top looks quite thick, but this is a hollow seal and it squashes down fairly easily but this actually takes up a space that the original seal didn't fill very well just in line with the top screw in the triangle of three. Bear in mind this one will look better fitting on the original weatherstrip as its replicating the original seal but sitting on a larger weatherstrip.
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This picture shows the thickness of the part above the latch, this bit require you to cut some small squares of rubber and bond them together until it the thickness you need, you will drill a hole through this for the retaining screw. Also notice the difference in shape between this seal and the one above, this is because one is replicating the original and the other to fit my setup.
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This is how the other end is finished, the original is thin at this point and this easily has enough "squash" in order to be watertight, in conjuction with the rubber A post seals this makes for formidable watertightness, but I tested it with my old originals as well and there is still plenty of pressure to seal it well. Notice the little recess below which is filled with black-tac, hardly even visible, and easy access to the screw if its needed without having to remove the seal!.
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The main body of the seal sits great against the door and doorcard, combine this with the fact it is bonded on as well as the studs it will be stupendously more waterproof than the original, better looking than the original, and a lot more durable than the original.
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So there you go, I hope a few folk are going to try this on their own car after me going to all this effort!. :D
Last edited by Jamie N on Sat 08.11.2014, 22:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby novacaine » Mon 03.11.2014, 22:41

I've said it before Jamie, but you are the rubber master!
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Tue 04.11.2014, 11:48

novacaine wrote:I've said it before Jamie, but you are the rubber master!

Lol, Ive been called worse I suppose :D .

One other thing about fitting these, when you stud the seal into the door what you have to do is, starting from the one closest to the latch, pop it in and pull the seal down to next hole on the door with a very very slight stretch, then check to see if there is a corresponding hole on the seal, some will be perfectly in line but some will be out by a cm or so, all you do is keep the seal in place with one hand and with your drill in the other with a 4mm bit, just drill a new hole in the seal, sounds a bit awkward I know but it really is dead easy, pop in one of the original seal plastic studs and move on to the next one until you get right round to the mirror area,i only had to drill 4 new holes on the seal, remarkably most were straight in line. Once the complete seal is fitted and everything is looking and fitting well, then you can remove the whole thing and put a line of sealant right round the door and pop the seal back on.

If anyone wants to give it a go but you cant find any donor seals let me know as I can get a few sets, as before with other seals I wont be "mass producing" :D these but im happy to make an odd few pairs for the folks that wont have the time or inclination to do it themselves, but seriously its worth giving it a try, it's probably the easiest of all our seals to make and whats the worst that can happen?, its unlikely to turn out worse than what you currently have ...so there you go, you now have no excuse :-D , go for it!. :wink:
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Megwenda » Tue 04.11.2014, 12:30

Jamie

Very interested, I have sent you a PM

Regards
Dave
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby dapinky » Tue 04.11.2014, 12:38

Megwenda wrote:Jamie

Very interested, I have sent you a PM

Regards
Dave


So have I :wink:
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Tue 04.11.2014, 14:52

No probs guys, like I said I can make a limited few so if you are interested let me know, I will post more pictures soon for the folks that would like to try it for themselves with a bit more detail, but basically this one is a no-brainer , if you are reasonably competent at fettling stuff and I know a lot of you are, then you will have success fairly easily, both sides can be modified and fitted in an afternoon coupled with the details above and other bits to follow, and the tools required are minimal and basic. ;-)
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby basher » Tue 04.11.2014, 15:19

Sounds Good Jamie and looks tidy and pretty professional.
I'm looking forward to instructions and having a bash...
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Rice crispy » Tue 04.11.2014, 15:27

Jamie pm sent also
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Steve A » Tue 04.11.2014, 16:26

I think the rubber to sponge ratio should be increased whenever possible, it can only improve the quality of the car 8)
The genius of rubber does it again :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby HJ2 » Tue 04.11.2014, 16:55

Like! :clap:
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby novacaine » Tue 04.11.2014, 18:09

PM sent also :D
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Tue 04.11.2014, 20:40

Just been back in the yard this afternoon and I have found something else!, provisionally looks to be a much better and easier alternative to the ones above, I will do some more experimentation and update the results, so in the meantime don't go getting crx or Subaru seals as this one looks like it will be the one. :wink:

Also could anyone post a good close up picture of a door seal that is in new condition, the top part above the latch, I cant find one anywhere. Both mine were a bit shabby so it was difficult to see exactly how its sitting in relation to the glass and weatherstrip.
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Eagle1 » Wed 05.11.2014, 00:00

Hi Jamie,

Sent you a PM let me know if it works?

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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby HJ2 » Wed 05.11.2014, 11:52

I'll get my camera out!
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Thu 06.11.2014, 22:03

Quick update again, I have not had much time to work on these new ones ive found, but what I have worked out is the CRX ones are not really worth pursuing for various reasons but most importantly, in retrospect I feel they are just a bit too short, they will reach with a stretch but I don't feel that is an ideal option, so we will write those off.

The Subaru ones still have potential to do the job, but again they are also slightly short but not as much as the Honda's, they will work but im trying to find something that is easier and can be modified to fit with the least amount of work.

So here is where we are now, I have 2 different door seals, 1 pair from a mk3 Celica (possibly the closest one yet) and 1 pair from a Mitsubishi FTO, from what ive found so far, both of those have the potential to fit well with modification and both are longer than needed, I just have not had time to finish them and see just how good they are going to be, so I will work on those over the weekend and keep you all posted on how they go.

All of the seals ive mentioned could be used for the job if you have the time and patience to work them out and fabricate as you go, but what im trying to do is find something that is close enough to the original and be easy enough to modify that most folk will be able to do them, and also be available, I suppose the Mitzy might be a problem in that respect right enough, but also bear in mind there are others out there still to be found!.

So does anyone have a good pic of an original seal in good condition or a link to one?, just need a good close picture of the part that meets the glass.
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Megwenda » Fri 07.11.2014, 10:22

Stripped my door down for you Jamie :D

But, after the door seal pics, I have a query for you as well.

Image
Image
Image
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By the way, I am having trouble aligning the door glass as can be seen in the two pictures below.

How high should the window go? I would have thought so that it fits the contours of the "A" post seal?

When I adjust it so that it fits all the way up into the mirror seal, it is too high relative to the "A" post seal, and does not go under the header seal. In the photos below, I have adjusted it so that it is quite a bit down (see first photo), and now it just fits under the header seal... problem is, in this position it does not fit snugly into the "A" post seal ... its too far backwards.

Image
Image

As you may rememebr, I had problems due to the fact that the header seal is from a S1, while the hood and header rail was from a S2.
I have managed to cut the header rail so that the seal fits, and the part where the window fits against lines up with the "a" post seal
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Fri 07.11.2014, 12:08

Thanks for the pictures Dave, much appreciated, I was not aware that the seal overlapped the weatherstrip so far, as mine were worn so much, this may make things easier to replicate, im on it :wink: .

As for the other issue you have, I had something similar on my left side door in the beginning, and the way I rectified it was to remove the A post seal bracket and reposition it where it best corresponded to the other seals. On my car, when the glass is all the way up the edge is sitting approximately 8 - 10 mm from the edge of the metal bracket , although mine now has everything surrounding the glass completely customised, even the weatherstrip, and every seal is rubber so its not the best one for comparisons.
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Megwenda » Sat 08.11.2014, 21:16

EDIT: Moved to THIS thread where it should be
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Jamie N » Sat 08.11.2014, 22:36

OK I have edited the original first post on this thread, complete with new pictures and all the details. The only problem now is the availability of the donor seals, there is only a single one on ebay that I can see. Im sure there will be a few in breakers yards though. The good news is I have been round all the yards in this area today and I have managed to get 5 pairs of them, all in good condition and I have even given them a hot soapy bath and scrub, no not indoors :D .

I don't think I can make any full sets of these as its just too time consuming, but also the fact that every car will be slightly different and I don't have OEM setup so the chances are if I make a pair to fit perfect on mine they wont necessarily fit perfect on a different Elan , but im happy to give any help to anyone who wants to do their own, anyone wanting a pair to try just send me a message. :wink:
Last edited by Jamie N on Sun 09.11.2014, 18:44, edited 1 time in total.
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https://youtu.be/MGiyiIFjUew Rubbery stuff.
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Re: Door Seals / The Rubber Solution.

Postby Megwenda » Sun 09.11.2014, 08:35

Looks great!

My order is already in :D

And if you have any A seals, they can be shipped at the same time. I haven't started rebonding mine yet, forgot it was Sunday, and we are not allowed to work
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