Windscreen woes

[Saltire]

I went out to clean the Lotus this morning prior to Castle Combe at the weekend (some people just have to be noticed ), and in the course of washing away, I noticed a crack at the top of the windscreen. Which is annoying, because a) it’s CC, and b) the MoT is booked for next Wednesday (29th).

The crack isn’t in my eyeline, and it’s outside the swept area of the wipers, but at 200mm it’s well above the 40mm limit for MoT.

So I’ll have to get it replaced. I’m with Footman James, and their approved repairer is National Windscreens, who I’ve not experienced before.

Does anyone have any tips or things I should look out it for when getting this work done (apart obviously from making sure that they allocate a fitter who’s actually got some experience of classic car work)? And has anyone any experience of using FJ for a windscreen replacement?

Thoughts welcome please before I try and get it sorted. Thanks in anticipation.

[dapinky]

J,
Sorry to hear of your woes. I have no personal knowledge of FJ claims (but don't expect it to be an issue), but I have had dealing with National Windscreens for my Elan....

.... it was many years ago, and I was fortunate that the depot manager knew what he was on about, and asked for me to take the car to him at the unit. This was because it required time for the primers and adhesives to cure properly before going on to the next stage and it was best left overnight. They would have done it at my home, but it was easier all round for me to take it in and have it done under cover and reduce the risk of contamination if left outside.

One thing to note, ensure they have the right glass on site before starting the job - there are different tints listed (if they can get them all).... you don't want to be left with a big hole while they wait for another one to arrive in one piece!

[Saltire]

Thanks, Dave, that’s really helpful. My nearest is Swindon, so I’ll give them a call and see what they say. Point about the tints noted; as my car is BRG, I’d anticipate a green tint screen but I will check first

[Tuga2112]

looking forward to hearing from your experience John. im with FJ as well, and althought my chip is not MOT problem, its been there for a while, its probably time to get it sorted.

[TorqueHorse]

Sorry to hear about that
I'm waiting on one being made from Pilkington right now (this is to replace the replacement that I already busted, but that's another story). Anyways, I have the green tint and you really cannot tell it is tinted unless you put a piece of white paper behind it, and it looks "normal". My door windows also have a slight green tint to them, and the new windscreen tint is the same, or fainter, if you want to get a feel for what it'll be like (or verify what you already have).
You might want to take a poke at your A-pillar seals to see if they are salvageable. Mine were just sitting in the channels and had not been sealed in there so I could reuse them, but the workshop guide shows they should be sealed in there.
Windscreen edging is still available at a lot of places (or it might be salvageable too), but for the top corner pieces, I've only found 3d printed ones. I think Mark Elvin's (s/p?) has some on ebay now?
The workshop manual says take off the leather wrapped interior a-pillar pieces to get the windscreen cutting tool in there, but depending on how they do it, that isn't always necessary. My leather was also pretty dry, so it ripped when I peeled away the top in order to get at and remove the set screws (which had also galvanically rusted into the aluminum frame, the screws being steel). So, if they don't absolutely have to, you might save yourself some hassle there.
Finally, for the rearview mirror, once the glass is out and face down on the ground, its easy to soak the metal plinth in acetone, and then it'll soon pop off with some persuasion from a razor blade (since there isn't a direct replacement for that little metal plinth, you'll want to reuse it. Dorman does sell some generic brackets #76864 but I don't know if they fit).
And I'd imagine that pieces of glass are easier to get hands on over there, but if your insurer can't find a piece easily, you might try calling around the regular lotus parts suppliers. I also got a good deal the last time from ricky evans motorsports, which had one in stock.
Good luck!

[Saltire]

Thanks, Matt, that’s all really helpful. I’ve had the A pillar covers off previously, and refitted them with stainless self tappers, so that won’t be a problem (famous last words). I’m worried about the A pillar seals, because they’re the new Jamie type, but I only used a very small amount of sealant when I put them in, so I think they’ll come out fine - and hopefully go back too.

My windscreen is green tint, so I have that in mind.

I fitted new corner pieces a while ago, and they came from Mark, but (I think) I have a spare pair in the odds box.

Great points about the interior mirror and I’ll be sure to save the metal plinth.

There’s a sense in which I’d rather be doing the job myself, but since the insurance will pay and the excess is minimal, I’m going to let them do it, but I’m going to discuss it with them first and make sure they have an older technician who knows about classic cars. I did phone the local depot this afternoon to try and talk to them, but the call is rerouted to a central call centre staffed by spotty twelve-year-olds who had no idea what I was talking about when I said “Lotus”. I’m going to stop by the depot tomorrow and see if I can get any sense out of them.

Thanks again, and watch this space . . .

[MPx]

Probably no longer relevant John, but when I last went to SJs (Sept last year) to pick up a temp sensor there was a stack of M100 screens just to the right of the counter leaning against the wall. Dont know if they were just passing through or if that's where their stock normally lives, but there were quite a few of them!

[Saltire]

Probably no longer relevant John, but when I last went to SJs (Sept last year) to pick up a temp sensor there was a stack of M100 screens just to the right of the counter leaning against the wall. Dont know if they were just passing through or if that's where their stock normally lives, but there were quite a few of them!

That was my first port of call, but when I saw it was going to cost me the best part of £500 I figured Footman James could pay However, if National Windscreens can’t get one, I may go down that route!

[Neil.G]

Morning all,
Had my windscreen replaced a couple of years ago by the same company albeit their Oxford unit. From memory there was confusion with the tint, I believe specific markets had specific tints. I also remember it was the same part number as a noble according to the fitter, I can't give a true account of their fitting skills because I'd removed my A-pillars and seals beforehand and decided to refit them myself once I'd finished resetting my door glass. The other point I remember was the obscuration band was ever so slightly different where the rear view mirror plinth attaches, only marginal and it actually seemed better positioning than my previous original screen for some reason. I have my seat spacer blocks removed and it just seemed to be a better placement for adjustment than before but can't really describe why!
They did send in their "special chap" to do the Lotus, he mentioned he was sent around the country for "special jobs"
Hope it goes well for you.

[JethroGreenfinger]

Sorry about your screen, but get it MOT'd first, there might be no issue

If you have an MOT in your pocket, you have more time to make less stressed decisions.

[Simon_P]

I've had a good experience with classic insurance although it was with Auto glass, who asked all of the right questions.

Various trims and seals will get damaged this is part of doing the job so make sure it's part of the replacement - they can't do it without so it is part of their cost.
Take the ws manual with you and give them a copy. The plinths seem to play an essential part of the alignment.

[Saltire]

Sorry about your screen, but get it MOT'd first, there might be no issue

If you have an MOT in your pocket, you have more time to make less stressed decisions.

Good thought, Jethro. I sent Adrian, my favourite MoT man, some photos this morning - he knows the car and is something of a fan. He says it will pass this time around, but I’ll need to get the screen replaced before 2025. So you’re right, the pressure is off for now

Thanks for the thought!

[Saltire]

Various trims and seals will get damaged this is part of doing the job so make sure it's part of the replacement - they can't do it without so it is part of their cost.
Take the ws manual with you and give them a copy. The plinths seem to play an essential part of the alignment.

Thanks, Simon. The seals is partly what I’m concerned about, because I have a set of Jamie’s all-in-one A pillar and screen rail seals fitted and I really don’t want them to be destroyed and replaced with something inferior or leakier. I think I will remove the seals myself and replace them afterwards. When I fitted them, I used very little sealant and stainless fasteners, so they should come out fairly easily (famous last words).

I’ve printed the relevant section of the WSM.

I’m puzzled about the plinths. The parts list implies that they are only for SE/NA cars, and I have an S2. SJs list a fitting kit, which allegedly includes sealant and plinths (and the mirror plinth which TorqueHorse warned me about previously). I’ll have to discuss it all with National Windscreens beforehand and agree a plan of action. Should be fun!

[Saltire]

UPDATE 12th July: Well, I went and chatted to National Windscreens in Swindon today, and was mostly reassured. They were quite happy to do the job, say it will not be a problem, and were able to answer all my questions about tints, seals, corner pieces etc. The car will need to go into their unit for half a day.

They say they can get the Pilkington screens like mine without a problem, and they assure me that the mirror plinth will be pre-attached to the new screen when it arrives. I’ve agreed to remove the Jamie seals, and the A pillar trim pieces, and refit them afterwards.

I now have to ring Footman James on Monday so they can authorise the work, and then the fitters will call me once they have a screen.

I’d feel a bit happier if they’d offered to get one of their specialists to fit it (as mentioned in a previous post on this thread), but . . . it’s a Lotus; how hard can it be

[Tuga2112]

UPDATE 12th July: Well, I went and chatted to National Windscreens in Swindon today, and was mostly reassured. They were quite happy to do the job, say it will not be a problem, and were able to answer all my questions about tints, seals, corner pieces etc. The car will need to go into their unit for half a day.

They say they can get the Pilkington screens like mine without a problem, and they assure me that the mirror plinth will be pre-attached to the new screen when it arrives. I’ve agreed to remove the Jamie seals, and the A pillar trim pieces, and refit them afterwards.

I now have to ring Footman James on Monday so they can authorise the work, and then the fitters will call me once they have a screen.

I’d feel a bit happier if they’d offered to get one of their specialists to fit it (as mentioned in a previous post on this thread), but . . . it’s a Lotus; how hard can it be

i hope everything goes as they assured you.

ive had experiences in the past where the nice lady at the call centre tells me their specialists are fully equiped and prepared to handle the intricacies of our cars... but when "mr expert" arrives he doesnt have a clue the car needs to be handled differently to the norm and will tell you he wasnt warned.

[Saltire]

i hope everything goes as they assured you.

ive had experiences in the past where the nice lady at the call centre tells me their specialists are fully equiped and prepared to handle the intricacies of our cars... but when "mr expert" arrives he doesnt have a clue the car needs to be handled differently to the norm and will tell you he wasnt warned.

And that’s exactly why I went and talked to the folks who will be doing it, rather than just speaking to the call centre. All the call centre has to do is authorise the fitters to go ahead.

[Saltire]

UPDATE 18th July: All good news so far. I called National Windscreens (Footman James insurance approved supplier) on Monday, and the call centre wasn’t actually too bad, although it took them quite a while to find “1995 Lotus Elan” on their list of vehicles. They took the details and “someone will call back”.

On Wednesday . . . Someone DID call back - the call centre again to say insurance approval was going through, and the screen would need to be ordered; 10-14 days “from a dealer”. The branch would call me to arrange fitting.

This morning . . . The branch manager who I spoke to last Friday rang me. He said the work order had come through, and he’d recognised it. Confirmed with me that it’s a green tint screen, says he can get it in 5-7 days, again from a dealer, and will ring me to arrange fitting once it’s arrived and he’s checked it.

I’ve said that I will remove Jamie’s seals and the trim pieces, and refit them once the new screen is in place; I don’t want them butchering Jamie’s careful work to get the old screen out. My final challenge is to remove the interior mirror so I can save the metal plinth referred to by TorqueHorse above, in case the new screen doesn’t come with one (although the fitter seems to think it will). I have a suction mount “driving instructor” mirror I can fix to the windscreen to take it the 20 miles or so to the workshop.

More news soon!

[Tuga2112]

in case the new screen doesn’t come with one (although the fitter seems to think it will).

when i got the screen swapped on the blue car, that metal plint was not there, and the company who supplied the glass told me theres only 1 factory making them (i think was finland he said)
just letting you know that, as my expectatin would be to need to glue the metal plint again.

ive had bad experience with that metal plint. as the one in the blue car did came out after a couple of years standaing and the yellow car had the same faith not long ago.
the branded glue from halfords for it didnt last more than 3 months, superglue lasted 6 months first time, and 2 years the second time.
currently its glued using epoxy glue (araldite brand) but that was only done a month ago, so its resilience is yet to be known

[dapinky]

Pinkys top tip of the day for metal plinth thingy.....

First, don't try to glue it on whilst the mirror is attached, just undo it so it's the metal bit...... obtain a small square of mesh (cotton or fibreglass) - the stuff used for applying over joints in plasterboard before skimming it - just a bit smaller than the size of the joint - single thickness.

Apply superglue to metal, then lay the mesh on top, apply more superglue and sprinkle it with baking powder whilst still wet..... this will make a paste and the chemical reaction sets it extremely hard within a short time.

Before that happens, remove any excess and place it where you want it. The mesh and bicarb/cyanoacrylate reaction will hold it in place until the cows come home!

[Saltire]

Thanks, Dave, that’s really helpful.

Amusingly, today I parked the Lotus in the magistrates car park, and when I came out 7 hours later, the mirror had completely detached from the screen and was hanging down on the interior light wires. I suspect the sun had baked it off, but it suits me, because I needed it off for the screen to be replaced anyway