pulling my head

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pulling my head

Postby stevo » Wed 07.09.2005, 13:16

hi all, you may or may not have read that missy broke down the day before the callander classic trip and that a head gasket or valve stem seals are perhaps to blame. so heres the deal.....

i have a new head gsk from mattys and a reasonably well equipped garage and i fancy having a go at this myself.

1 im thinking with the head pulled out is there anything else that i should fit while im at it, like seals, gaskets, new head bolts etc?

2 is there a "hotter" pair of cams avalible from on of our yank cousins?

3 how much should i have skimed off the head?

4 i have had a go at porting a rover v8 head before and fancy slightly widening and matching missys inlet and exhaust ports. i know its more of an N/A thing but is it worth while?

5 what is the torque setting for the head bolts and torqueing order(is this in the service manual coz i cant find it)?

6 the cam belt is 1year/10000miles old i want to keep it, should i just mark it with paint before striping to put it back on the right place?

thanks in advance people :wink:
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Postby Sy V » Wed 07.09.2005, 13:21

Stevo

Service Manual
Engine (Section EC)
Page 9
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Postby stevo » Wed 07.09.2005, 13:30

ah ha! :oops: thanx mate. but what about the order or is this not importent?
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Postby Sy V » Wed 07.09.2005, 13:43

Same section, page 37.
I suggest you read all pages between these too mate.
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Postby stevo » Sun 11.09.2005, 11:12

i printed out the whole section, it has made for a heavy bit of toilet reading over the past week but im feeling confident. i'll give my garage a bit of a tidy out first then sorce 8 little boxes and a big tin of gunk. 8)
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Postby stevo » Sun 11.09.2005, 19:57

found this site interesting..http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/mainmenu.htm
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Postby steven » Tue 13.09.2005, 15:08

Stevo

check the radiator by-pass pipe, it runs from the inlet spout behind the exhaust manfold. special attention to the connection of the pipe and the spout. Spout is made of alu and the pipe is steel and there is only an O-ring in between.

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Postby Monty » Wed 21.09.2005, 22:59

hows the Heads going Stevo :?:
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Postby stevo » Thu 22.09.2005, 13:16

im waiting on a book arriving on modding and rebuilding cylinder heads. but its out of stock just now and waiting on reprint. :(
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Postby stevo » Sun 02.10.2005, 20:54

well today me and my dad spent 8 hours pulling missys head off. it was a trick job but we got there in the end. the good news is that the cylinder liners look good and there is a clear split in the gasket from one of the coolant chanels into no.1 cylinder (the one i pulled the shitty looking plug from. the head and block surfaces look good but i wont know about the stem seals untill i strip the head down later this week. i've got skint knuckles and my eyes sting from having fuel srayed in them(she put up a good fight) but im none the worse for wear and defo not put off at the size off the next task. :? :roll:

p.s i had to make a wee tool from a bit of 10mm box key cut to about 10mm long welded on to a bit of flat bar to get the middle one of the 5 cam belt cover bolts out. nice bodge.

hers some pics....
[url]http://photos.wanadoo.co.uk/album/album_contact.html?c_album=1927962[/url
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Postby Stef » Tue 04.10.2005, 14:45

Ooooo! How did I miss this wonderfully titled thread??!! :lol:

Can't see the pics mate as the link says I am not logged in.

Sounds like a big task. Hope she'll make it for Stonleigh.
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Re: pulling my head

Postby Dave M » Tue 04.10.2005, 17:26

stevo wrote:1 im thinking with the head pulled out is there anything else that i should fit while im at it, like seals, gaskets, new head bolts etc?

2 is there a "hotter" pair of cams avalible from on of our yank cousins?

3 how much should i have skimed off the head?

4 i have had a go at porting a rover v8 head before and fancy slightly widening and matching missys inlet and exhaust ports. i know its more of an N/A thing but is it worth while?

5 what is the torque setting for the head bolts and torqueing order(is this in the service manual coz i cant find it)?

6 the cam belt is 1year/10000miles old i want to keep it, should i just mark it with paint before striping to put it back on the right place?

Stevo, sorry for not seeing this until now. I've been way busy with work lately and haven't had much site time... :oops:

#1 - New head bolts aren't a bad idea. The stock ones *can* stretch and upgrading to a ARP set (or the like) can help prevent future head gasket issues. Also depends on your power goals in the future. May be the stock ones will be fine for you. Depending on how quick you are putting things back together, I'm sure ARP could get you a set quickly.

#2 - Changing cams will affect day to day driveability. I don't know of any custom ones out there, even through the Isuzu guys. I think some have used the 1.8L cams, but without knowing all the parameters and what they change, I'd avoid it. My shop recommended flowing the head to maximize the capability of the stock cams. This should retain stock idle and around town driving, yet be a cheaper and more effective upgrade than custom grind cams.

#3 - Only enough to make it completely flat. Too much and you'll bump the compression.

#4 - I asked about porting, but my shop only did enough to flow match the intake/exhaust sides. They said if too much material was removed, you could actually make performance worse. Porting a turbo car is usually done in conjunction with matched cams.

#5 - I think Sy got you that reference.

#6 - May have done this already, but that sounds fine.

Good luck with things!
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Postby stevo » Tue 04.10.2005, 22:42

cheers dave, i have already ordered a set of oe bolts from sj but the cams from the 1.8 sound like they might be worth a go. :? i don't need to fit them this time but now i know my way around missys oily bits i could swop them in a couple of hours. do you think any of the isuzone guys would have some sound used cams lying around that i could fit in the future to test?

im off to aviemore to spend the weekend chilling in my mates cabin so porting the head can wait for my return. 8)

stef, i can't work this photo s**t to save myself will re post link soon when i can be arsed.
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Postby Dave M » Wed 05.10.2005, 18:08

Crap...here's one you just missed but gives you the year and model of a potential donor.

http://www.isuzone.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8653

Check around the rest of the site - there's bound to be a set you can get for cheap. Maybe this guy who may have the parts?

http://www.isuzone.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8590

Also, here's a thread from someone who recently did the cam swap. You could ask some questions here of those who have done it already. But FYI, there are a lot of great guys on the board who do things with no dyno proof that it helps things. Swapping cams that make the engine "peaky" may *feel* like it is faster, but without a dyno sheet, I'd be hesitant.

http://www.isuzone.org/forums/showthrea ... ht=1.8+cam
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Postby stevo » Fri 14.10.2005, 18:03

evenin allllll.

i got my head skimmed this week by cylinder head express in govan. it took 30min to do while i waited and cost a very resonable 25 quid. they took off 7 thou thats about a ball hair or to 4 fag papers in new money. the guy gave me lots of advice about flowing and valve seats and s**t, very intresting stuff. i have also received my copy of "how to build, modify & power tune clyinder heads" by peter burgess & david gollan, published by speed pro series. its pretty old school(mostly 8v heads) but the theory is sound and its got me on the right direction. the bloke in the head skimming place said that the head looked quite efficient all ready but pointed out a couple of places that it could be improved. he also can take more of the head and reseat the valves if i make a mess of it.

p.s dont panic im only taking off a couple of burrs and bad bits of casting then smoothing out the ports im not going nuts and cutting down the guides or inlargeing s**t. :roll: :twisted:

so far....
head gsk £25
skim £25
new head bolts £50
ngk platinum plugs(bling baby) £40
mobil 1 £30
lotus oil filter £10
coolant £10

total £190

not bad for a head job and service. 8)
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Postby Stef » Sat 15.10.2005, 18:04

Mmmmm Looking forward to inspecting your head at Stonleigh :wink:

Anyway, I thought you said at Donington that Missy had enough power?? :P
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Postby Nige » Sat 15.10.2005, 18:40

Only when you can leave black lines from exiting one corner to braking for the next do you have enough power :twisted:

(I thought all TVR drivers knew that :shock: )
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Postby stevo » Sun 30.10.2005, 01:15

progress!

i have slightly modded the head by grinding off the rought bits and smoothing the the ports and combustion chambers. the engineering shop has reground the seats and lapped in the valves and cut the exhaust valves from 2 angles to a graduated curve then fitted the valves/springs/collets/tappets for me.
today i started reasembeling the plenum and manifolds and bolted the head back on to the block. tomorrow i will plumb her back up and plug in all the cables, fit the turbo and stiffy, fit my ab cables, do the timing and fluids. i bought some cheap 10-40w to run for a couple of miles to flush her out and then i'll put her usual tipple of mobil1 in.

hopefully i can turn her over tomorrow night, fingers crossed. :roll:
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Postby Doc Fizzix » Sun 30.10.2005, 19:50

stevo wrote: the cams from the 1.8 sound like they might be worth a go. :? i don't need to fit them this time but now i know my way around missys oily bits i could swop them in a couple of hours. do you think any of the isuzone guys would have some sound used cams lying around that i could fit in the future to test?


I am not 100% sure, but from all of the reading I have been doing with my motor rebuld and from discussions I have had with several Isuzu gurus I think the cam that is used in the 1.8L Isuzu motor is the same cam already in our motor.

Try this link, look about half way down the page and there is a chart with detals on the cams in different Isuzu motors, I think that Isuzu just put the 1.8L cams and lifters in the motors they shipped to Lotus. The cams in the 1.8L Isuzu motor have the same specs as the cams already in the Elan:

http://www.robietherobot.com/storm/geo_ ... s_DOHC.htm
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Postby DeeAitch » Sun 30.10.2005, 21:23

From this data it looks like the 1.8 = Clemo :oops: SE's don't match any although the manual does not specify lift.
Those I=mark ones look to be longer duration although Robbie is not happy. Anyone know what I-mark is :?
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