The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Thu 12.11.2015, 01:31

Sorry, I was cutting and pasting and apparently didn't copy the second part number. Now corrected.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby johanvanboven » Sat 14.11.2015, 01:14

Hi Pete,
Sorry for the late answer, in winter my car is asleep and LEC visits are reduced. 'Reduced' might not be the good translation, but can't find the right word.
For your question asked on 06/11, the answer is yes, you can fit the PMF172.
http://www.mister-auto.co.uk/en/search_ ... MF172.html
You will experience a much better brake 'pedal feel'
The smaller diameter BMC has now been fitted 2 yrs ago and is still doing it's better job than the OEM one.
Can someone who did the same confirm this, or did anyone had problems by fitting this BMC on his/hers car?
BR,
Johan
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby dapinky » Sat 14.11.2015, 10:25

johanvanboven wrote:Can someone who did the same confirm this, or did anyone had problems by fitting this BMC on his/hers car?


I fitted the same part from 'Mr Auto' and have had no problems with it.

My only observation is as stated previously, I'm still on OE callipers, so I can't say what difference it would make on a car with a larger (calliper) fluid displacement requirement.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby epipete » Sat 14.11.2015, 11:22

Thanks Guys, my brakes appear to be fixed now, but I may order one in just to complete the job.

Pete
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby lotustonybassplayer » Fri 22.07.2016, 15:06

For those that have fitted this "upgrade" has there been any issues :?: I did buy the MBC when the thread first started but not fitted yet. As i might be doing some brake work and will have to bleed the system, i wondering if it is worth doing whilst i'm at it. I have the standard brake set up by the way.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby johanvanboven » Wed 10.08.2016, 16:46

Hi,
For the extra half hour that you will need to change the BMC, it would be a pity to leave it on the shelf.

Also, think about it, the seals in the OEM BMC are about 25 or more yrs old by now.

Have fun!
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Readit » Wed 02.08.2017, 21:46

I have come across this thread rather late, but if you listen to Chris Goffey in the 1990 Top Gear Elan test he says, just after the "water in footwell" and "intrusive armrest", that the brake pedal travel is a bit long, but Lotus say production models will be shorter. Perhaps they took the smaller servo out in favour of a larger one?
All the best plans are flexible, Lotus use Sicaflex.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby clemo » Tue 13.02.2018, 22:09

having read this thread fully i have decided to replace my master cylinder as a matter of course ( with a standard one)

options i have :-

Kelvedon - original part number A100J6048S £96.29 Inc Vat.
http://www.kelsport.net/parts/product_d ... ectionID=2


Sj's Original part number A100J6048S £330 inc Vat.
https://www.sjsportscars.com/parts-and- ... J6048S.htm


Sj's Replacement part number SJ100J0015 £60.47 inc Vat.
https://www.sjsportscars.com/parts-and- ... 0J0015.htm

Question
Is the Kelvedon part an original or patten ?
Is the Sj's replacement as good as the Original ?

What say the crowd ?
Thank you for your opinion .

Clemo
What say the crowd?
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Tue 13.02.2018, 22:57

The original BMC was aluminum. Most replacements are Cast Iron (or steel). For a special car, I would ask Kelvedon if theirs is original and aluminum and make my decision. The OE at SJs is Aluminum but their replacement is obviously steel.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby lotusflasherman » Wed 14.02.2018, 01:56

clemo wrote:
Question
Is the Kelvedon part an original or patten ?

Clemo
What say the crowd?


Dave,
A substantial part of my Eclat came through the post from Pat Thomas at Kelvedon Motors, who was regularly voted 'dealer of the year' by Club Lotus members. That was before the internet so used the dog & bone and Pat is one of the most genuine & helpful guys you could ever meet. I know he's virtually retired but the service continues.. If they list a part by Lotus Part Number 'I'd bet my bottom dollar' that it came from Hethel. They do sell upgrades and parts for racing but those have their own part numbers.. Like my ITG foam air filter is 'RACEFAF01A'..

Look on the Parts page and you'll see "We have a comprehensive stock of Lotus parts for old and new models, and provide a mail order service to customers in the UK and worldwide. With years of technical expertise we can help you source those hard to find parts. We place a weekly stock order direct to the Lotus factory for those parts we don't have in stock, please place your order by 10am Wednesday, for delivery to us on Friday and on to you without delay. We also have the facility for VOR (vehicle off the road) overnight orders for those urgent parts." ..
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby clemo » Wed 14.02.2018, 09:41

Thank you John / Phil

What difference does it make if its steel or Aluminium ?
As long as the size and more importantly as this thread has shown the diameter of the bore & seals is correct then are they not as good as the original? Some may say a unit that has been sitting around un oiled for 20 years may be worse than a 2 year old re manufactured one ? Maybe ?


This will have a bearing on my final choice .

Thank you
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Rambo » Wed 14.02.2018, 10:53

clemo wrote:having read this thread fully i have decided to replace my master cylinder as a matter of course ( with a standard one)

options i have :-

Kelvedon - original part number A100J6048S £96.29 Inc Vat.
http://www.kelsport.net/parts/product_d ... ectionID=2


Sj's Original part number A100J6048S £330 inc Vat.
https://www.sjsportscars.com/parts-and- ... J6048S.htm


Sj's Replacement part number SJ100J0015 £60.47 inc Vat.
https://www.sjsportscars.com/parts-and- ... 0J0015.htm

Question
Is the Kelvedon part an original or patten ?
Is the Sj's replacement as good as the Original ?

What say the crowd ?
Thank you for your opinion .

Clemo
What say the crowd?


A small part of the crowd says its a no brainer

If the part nos indicate OEM stock then it comes down to price so you can kick SJS out of the equation. Simple maths ...£96.29 vs £330. Not sure why there is a huge discrepancy in prices but its your gain

So then its Kelvedon original at £96.29 vs an SJS replacement at £60.47. So for the sake of £36 quid I'd say go with OEM from Kelvedon ;-)
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Rambo » Wed 14.02.2018, 10:56

Incidentally, if Kelvedon have to get the part direct from Hethel you could possibly request it goes direct to your nearest dealership (as happens in the Lotus aftersales goods) It might save you a few quid in postage and packing costs :cheers:
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Simon_P » Wed 14.02.2018, 14:11

clemo wrote:having read this thread fully i have decided to replace my master cylinder as a matter of course ( with a standard one)

I've read it fully and I'm not sure why you would change your M/C for a standard one is it broken or the wrong size?

Without knowing why you are changing it it is difficult to offer an opinion.

Changing brake fluid is a matter of course, changing the m/C is a matter of exception.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby clemo » Wed 14.02.2018, 18:18

Simon_P wrote:
clemo wrote:having read this thread fully i have decided to replace my master cylinder as a matter of course ( with a standard one)

I've read it fully and I'm not sure why you would change your M/C for a standard one is it broken or the wrong size?

Without knowing why you are changing it it is difficult to offer an opinion.

Changing brake fluid is a matter of course, changing the m/C is a matter of exception.



System has been drained and new lines fitted , BOB brown rear hubs to be fitted with Hi Specs going on the front .
Seems like a may as well do item whist i can .

Yay or Nay ?
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Wed 14.02.2018, 18:25

How long did it sit with no fluid? The seals could/will dry up if left exposed to air after being used.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby clemo » Wed 14.02.2018, 19:12

Brit-Car-Nut wrote:How long did it sit with no fluid? The seals could/will dry up if left exposed to air after being used.


Well as the garage is not just down the road from me its a bit of an unknown , It could be 4 months or considerably less . My reason for change was more that i can still be done now what with the upgrades coming . So almost to future proof it .

Do you have an option on remanufacture V Original John ?
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Wed 14.02.2018, 20:03

I would never use a rebuilt when a new one is available. Just for originality, I would go with the aluminum one (if Kelverdon's is aluminum).

The outside of the steel one will eventually tarnish and rust.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby Simon_P » Wed 14.02.2018, 22:23

If your caliper piston sizes are different to standard you should probably do the calcs. Or check someone else's.
You need to make sure that there is sufficient travel (also when one circuit fails).

It is unlikely that there is anything wrong with your m/C. The reasons for failure are ingress of dirt scoring the cylinder, ingress of moisture causing corrosion, or just plain worn out. Brake fluid is hygroscopic so will take moisture from the atmosphere if left open.

If you haven't left the pipes open near the mc it's probably OK... or as OK as it was before you did the work. Your car you decide!
In your situation I would clean and inspect the components. It is simple enough, not much different from other brake work, but exceptional cleanliness is required. Only one circlip - the details and pictures are on here somewhere. + MC rebuild videos on YouTube.

Only use clean brake fluid to clean rubber parts and in reassembling - don't use brake cleaner on the rubber or any oil or grease including copper grease anywhere near where it can come in contact with the rubber brake seals. It is a different type of rubber and will swell.

The usual disclaimers! It's entirely your responsibility.
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Re: The cheapest way to upgrade the brakes.

Postby dapinky » Sat 17.02.2018, 18:18

Late to the party (cos' i'm on vacation!).....

..... my situation is always different to yours - i like to play with things like this just to see what can be achieved (safely!). I do all the maths and material studies, then test it out on a big bit of tarmac which is closed to the public - only then do i tend to publish results/findings/recommendations.

From earlier maths, your MC will cope with a (partial ?) system failure with the callipers you have got (or intend to fit in the future) - with either bore size that I have worked with.

If I were in your shoes, I'd fit a new MC with the OE bore, just for the sake of it (In my shoes, I'd strip, measure and check what I have fitted - then decide what to do with it regards repair/replace). If you can get an Aluminium one for not a lot more than a steel one, then do so - otherwise, steel will be adequate - especially if you spray it with a coat of clear laquer before fitting it and then change the fluid every couple of years.

.... must go now, my beer is getting hot :?
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