Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

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Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Fri 05.11.2010, 11:29

I've decided to get round to showing where the damage occurs and how I did some quick fixes whilst waiting for my £200+ new cables. :shock:

So, If you've ended up reading this thread you'll most probably have one of the following symtoms and would like to know where to go next...

If the Élan has an Achilles heel this is it, the issues were found on the test mules and the problems were never really addressed. :(

There are four types of cables available:-

Early N/A and SE cables (normally white)
Later N/A and SE cables (normally Black)
S2 cables (more robust than the afore mentioned items)
AB aftermarket cables (Metal mounting)

Your symptoms are normally as follows:-

1) Unable to select a gear, gear stick seems floppy.
2) Some of the gears seem to work and some don't.
3) A quick gear change exacerbates the issue.
4) Slow gear changes sometimes works.
5) Everything seems to move and work fine when viewed from the engine bay.
6) The gear box is stuck in 5th gear
7) The car will not drive in any gear
8 ) Difficulty engaging reverse

The answers


1) Unable to select a gear.

a) Broken selector cable.
b) sheared gear stick mounting points, there are four.
c) Clutch assembly failure.
d) Gearbox requires overhaul.


2) Some of the gears seem to work and some don't.

a) One of the two selector cables has broken.
b) poorly adjusted cables.
c) The adjuster locking ratchet has failed.
d) The crimp has failed at the end of the cable
e) A selector Cable has a cracked plastic mounting bracket .


3) A quick gear changes exacerbates the issue.

a) A selector Cable has a cracked plastic mounting bracket .

4) Slow gear changes sometimes work.

a) A selector Cable has a cracked plastic mounting bracket.

5) Everything seems to move and work fine when viewed from the engine bay.

a) Chances are you can't see the crack because the circlip is covering it.

6) The gear box is stuck in 5th gear

a) The selector box has failed
b) The gearbox has failed


7) The car will not drive in any gear

a) Bugger!!!

8) Difficulty engaging reverse

a) Reverse gear is a crash gear on the Élan, so this is normal, try putting the car in forth this should align the gears and try reverse again

So when it comes to the crunch there are only a few things that give up the ghost when it comes to the gears.
The selector box jamming in 5th gear has been done to death, the 5th gear nut issue has been done to death, So that just really leaves the cables.

So here's the first picture of where to check:-

Fault 1 is ratchet failure, the cable conduit moves back and forth, but the inner "Bowden" style cable does not engage the chosen gear.

Fault 2 is the number one cause of all failures, this normally occurs at the gearbox mount, but can on occasions occur at the opposing end of the cable.

Two tell tale signs are a missing circlip or the circlip is actually in the crack

Fault 3 is the failure of the elbow aspect of the plastic conduit. (I've carried out a temporary repair with a Pink composite resin)

Fault 4 is the failure of the swage that holds the wire in the attachment point.

Image

The two types of circlips that are available, the Wire circlip and the E-Circlip

Image

So how to carry out a temporary repair:-

Fault 1

Ty-wrap or locking wire, this should now hold the locking pawls in place.

Fault 2

i) Remove the damaged cable and the mount from the car
ii) Use a normal plastic glue and fill the crack, this will enable you to put the circlip back on without it splitting the plastic
iii)Then use an aluminium putty all over the top, this will give the strength back. Please don't be tempted just to use to do step ii) it won't work.
iv) Careful where you put the putty as it needs to go both sides of the mount for strength and yet the cable still needs to be adjustable.
v) Wait 24 hrs, put it all back in.

These Temp repairs lasted for a year or more, until I could be bothered to fit the new cables.

Image

Image

Fault 3

Composite resin repair

Fault 4

If the crimp fails, remove the cable and re-swage the crimp.

The four mounts on the gear stick mount have been known to crack

Image

Hope that helps...

TTFN
If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire... The N/A-Team.
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby tomac1975 » Fri 05.11.2010, 19:14

:goodposting:
:D
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby HJ2 » Fri 05.11.2010, 23:54

Excellent!

A lot of newbies to be refered to this post :lol:
Perhaps ad my piccie of the failed crimp? :poke:
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Sat 06.11.2010, 00:43

Definitely :poke:

The more knowledge out there the better, and a picture is worth a 1000 words and all that...

I didn't even mention stiff AB cables... forgot all about it... :roll:

One day I think I'll do the selector fix in detail and then the 5th gear nut issue (all with nice pointy arrows and more clariforcation)

I'll then tie up all the lose ends and do a Wiki entry to finish off.

I just need the time...
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Steve A » Sat 06.11.2010, 01:19

Specky is top :banana: 8)
"If everything is under control, you are going too slow."
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby bobbrown » Sat 06.11.2010, 12:03

Specky

As a point of interest, I changed my cables some years ago now, with the standard ones with the platic adjuster and did not tighten up the shift cable quite enough and when you are agressive with the shift is slips and the gear does not engage but not a problem as you shift the other way and it returns to where it was. I left it like this as it means there is less chance of breaking the "E" clip out of the bit of plastic which is a weak point.
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Thu 23.12.2010, 21:05

Here's a similar system for sale on Ebay,

Clicky

TTFN
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby bobbrown » Fri 24.12.2010, 10:19

similar to what? a bodge?
About the only useful thing is the wire cutters but I bet they do not come with it
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby HJ2 » Sun 09.01.2011, 10:32

I became quite handy in replacing S2 cables now (like 30 ... 45 minutes)

However last month i installed 3 of Dave's shortshifts, all in S1's, and i want to adjust the gearlever position. With the S2 cables quite easy, but how do i do this on the good old S1 cables without the risk of breaking something? :?:
I think all tips are in the right tread here!
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Sun 09.01.2011, 12:49

It's really easy, it's just a case of a 1/4 turn self locking racket. When unlocked you can adjust the square protruding portion and lock it off again. If the gearstick is stiff don't force it, unlock and readjust.

Double check the racket has positively locked, if the tangs have worn a tywrap will hold them in.

IMHO the S1 cables are easy to adjust in comparison to the AB's

TTFN
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby HJ2 » Sun 09.01.2011, 14:06

Thanks specky,

So: From the Top picture, rotate the part (that is marked as fault 1 :-)) 1/4 turn counter clockwise, and then adjustment is free?
I can rotate it 'in situ' without releasing anything else first? That sounds easy enough!

Cheers,
Henk-Jan


By the way: Here's the piccie of the failed crimp:

Image
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Sun 09.01.2011, 14:19

Yep...

And cheers for the pic, I'll add it to the top pics sometime

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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby DeanG » Sun 09.01.2011, 18:16

Please post the the wiki
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby JeffJ » Mon 10.01.2011, 03:04

On 'Enright's suggestion

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=18468

may I post my request for advice here?

Please feel free to move it elsewhere if my doing so is not appropriate, or if it is felt to detract from this very technical treatment of the topic.

On Friday night, in central London, my car stuck in gear (it seems to be in third) when I was manoeuvring in a parking space to get better centred within the white lines. At least it didn't stick in reverse.

It is hard to determine exactly which gear the car is in, as the lever is hard over to the right, moving in a ‘floppy’ way fore and aft, with no sideways movement.

The car (a 40,000+ mile SE) is fitted with original equipment cables, and not the S2 or AB versions, as far as I can tell.

It was taken to Steve Williams’ Sports Cars in Maidenhead by the AA. The patrolman (who spoke in a thick Polish accent, which I found difficult to understand) removed the leather and rubber gaiters and undid the gear lever at the four mounting points, and opined that the selector had failed, though I was unable to get him to explain further, nor to clarify whether it was the selector mechanism itself that had failed, nor whether the problem was a cable failure at the ‘selector/gear lever end’.

I will have to wait for Steve Williams to diagnose the problem, but I’d naturally be interested in people’s opinion as to what he might find, assuming that my description of the symptoms is adequate to give anyone sufficient clues as to the cause of the problem.

I wanted to try to find out whether the AB Motorsport cables are still available (and from where, and at what sort of price, and how long it takes to obtain them), and how many man-hours I might be billed for for having them changed?

I wonder perhaps whether anyone (especially anyone living near Maidenhead) might have a set that I could buy (or that I might ‘borrow’ and then replace with new AB cables that I could order?) in order to get my car back on the road as soon as possible?

Or if it is a problem with the selector, whether these are still available (and at what sort of price, and from where)?

I wonder whether anyone might explain the advantages and disadvantages of the various ‘short shift’ modifications that seem to be available?

I apologise for the length of this post, and for making my first proper post on the forum a request for advice and help.
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Specky » Mon 10.01.2011, 10:39

My best guess, but a bit vague

Fore-aft cable cracked (fault 2)

2-3 hrs work,

one Lotus fore-aft cable £100 (est)

A pair of AB cables £250 (est)

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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby JeffJ » Mon 10.01.2011, 13:22

Thank you. That sounds like a very sensible diagnosis, and I welcome your cost/labour guesstimates, which tally with my own.

I now believe that I did commit some kind of breach of etiquette by posting on your topic, and I apologise for having done so. Selfishly, I suspect that my requests for advice as to how and where to obtain these things may be less visible here, and so at Ray D's suggestion, I will post my own topic, if a new poster is allowed to do that.
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby AnonImouse » Mon 10.01.2011, 20:55

Bad luck Jon!
The only good cat is a dead one.
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby JeffJ » Tue 11.01.2011, 16:21

?

Steve Williams (or one of his workshop staff) has reported back, and it was 'Fault 2'. The circlip (the E-shaped one) was lying in the tunnel, apparently.

New cables required!
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby Rambo » Mon 14.02.2011, 12:56

AnonImouse wrote:Bad luck Jon!


On the ball as always Ratty. Nothing gets past your beady eyes ;-)
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Re: Gear cable temporary repair and diagnosis

Postby ecb056 » Thu 21.06.2012, 11:41

Does anybody have a PDF copy of the AB cable installation instructions that were posted at http://www.abmotosport.com/Elan_gearcable_fitment.htm?
This domain has expired.
I have AB cables on the way from DB.
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