Gear cable issues

Drivetrain problems

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Gear cable issues

Postby epipete » Tue 04.02.2014, 19:06

John,

Everything is now fine, I took the car out, gingerly, this afternoon just to make sure that all the gears were working, and, yes, all engage very evenly, however, whilst 1/2 and 5/reverse are easy to find (obviously either end of the cross gate cable), 3rd & 4th are less so, not because there is difficulty in engaging, more that the gear lever is stiff and doesn't self centre hence it isn't so obvious where on the cross gate it moves fore and aft.

Maybe it'll all work loose or perhaps I'll just have to become accustomed to it!

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Tue 04.02.2014, 20:13

Pete:

The Bob B. cable kit SHOULD self center. That is what makes it better than the AB kit. Something in the crossgate is "dragging". At the gearbox, remove the cable from the CG bellcrank (the upper connection). With the gearbox in neutral - lower lever in the middle - you should be able to push the CG bellcrank up and down but it should be spring loaded and if you push it and let it go, it should return to the middle. If it does this, then while the cable is still disconnected, see if there is any binding or resistance when you move the shift lever back and forth. It should feel as loose as if the cables are not connected.

If there is no resistance or dragging, make sure the hardware at the gearbox is assembled correctly AND the ball in the rod end moves better than easily. It should roll around the housing with almost nothing restricting it. There shouldn't be any slop or free-play, but it shouldn't take any effort to roll it around. The cone spacers get installed with the narrow ends toward the rod end and when everything is tight, the rod end should be perpendicular to the pivot bolt, NOT listing to one side.

Any chance of sneaking your camera down there and taking a few snaps? You can email them to me so I can see if something doesn't "look right".

We WILL get this right!
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Sun 09.02.2014, 15:06

John,

Given a combination of weather (Wet & Cold), loss of light (the wind blew my tripod lamp over!) and general boredom, I only managed to look at this this morning.

Your advice, as always, is good though, and on undoing the cross gate link at the gearbox the bell crank acts as you describe - spring loaded and selfcenters.

The cross gate cable when moved from either end (gearbox or gearchanger) grinds somewhere and is obviously the issue.

It'll need to be pulled out and looked at, it was a bit stiff prior to me putting it in but I thought it was because I was moving it by hand and assumed it would be ok in situ, obviously not.

So, I'll get it out and let you know; I fear I may yet be returning to you for a set of cables, any feel for delivery turnaround times?

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Sun 09.02.2014, 15:10

Pete: USPS and UK Mail seem to conspire to take around 7 days for deliveries. You shouldn't need to buy a set of cables, I can help you figure what has problems and will supply the bits you need to make it right. I have some early parts I made that are a match to the Bob B. system to start the project and plenty of stainless stock available to make a few bits. I suspect it will be a hardware issue or maybe a bad rod-end, so when the weather and time improve, let's talk.

You have a PM.
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Coolant supply & Gear Cable Change

Postby epipete » Sat 15.02.2014, 21:21

John

I've now removed the gear cables again and have stripped the CG Cable down of all the 'ends' and there is still a resistance on moving the inner cable though the sleeve.

The sleeve seems in fair condition without any evidence of perforation or being over stressed and is crimped at either end so I am unable to remove the inner cable to inspect it for defects.

image.jpg


It would seem as though I am going to need a replacement cable, what do you think?

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Sat 15.02.2014, 22:05

Sounds like a new cable is in order.

The cables is Felsted all stainless steel part number 200-M4222 /1235 with 6mm ends instead of 1/4inch. The travel is 2 inches. I use an Imperial dimension set for my cables.
Bob got his from a UK Company, probably http://www.cable-tec.co.uk/applications ... cables.asp. Their phone # is 01623 440398.

The part number should be all you need. I thought he also used Custom Control Cables in the UK, but I can't find a listing, but I will call my supplier on Monday to get their number for their UK office. It is way less expensive to order the cables from the UK rather than the US.

That is for the Crossgate Cable. How does the Fore/Aft Cable feel? They SHOULD feel about the same, so I hope the CG cable is stiffer / more binding?
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Sat 15.02.2014, 22:35

Thanks John,

Seems that the home page of Custom Control Cables uses a photo of the identically shrouded cable (pity they are in the US) is it that all Felstead cables are this pale mauve?

I'll give Cable-tec a call on Monday and see if they can help.

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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Sat 15.02.2014, 22:48

I believe standard design Felsted cables are purple (mauve). They did offer a flat black option, but it was a lot more expensive, so I stick with the purple (mauve) colored jacket.
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Mon 17.02.2014, 02:23

John, so as not to let Cable-Tec think me a complete idiot (though everybody on here now knows differently :-D) when I call tomorrow can you clarify what "6mm ends instead of 1/4inch"


If I give them the following description will that be sufficient?
The cables is Felsted all stainless steel part number 200-M4222 /1235 with 6mm ends instead of 1/4inch. The travel is 2 inches.

Cheers
Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Mon 17.02.2014, 04:01

Pete: The normal Felsted cables use 1/4 inch threaded ends that the rod ends thread up on. Bob specified making them metric, so you need to tell them the specs as they are written. They shouldn't question anything. I assume you are just ordering the single cable? If not, the other cable is a different length. For the Fore/aft cable you would order #200-M4222-1210 with 2 inches of travel and 6mm ends. I expect the cables should cost around 65 quid each, so only buy what you need...

This is from the earlier Bob B. posting:

The cables are Felsted all stainless steel part numbers M4222 /1210 and 1235 the last numbers are the overall length it mm and the ends are M6 not the standard 1/4". To clarify the cross gate is 1235mm and the main cable is 1210mm overall length with 2" of travel. These cables are 4 series with both ends the same but the thread on the end M6 not 1/4-28 UNF.

I would be surprised if they have any issues with the part number I already sent you.

I will check here when I get moving in the morning to make sure you don't have any problems ordering.
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Mon 17.02.2014, 13:17

John

Cable ordered from Cable-tec and delivery due 2/3 days! Your estimate was out somewhat :roll: but I won't hold you to account :D

I'll let you know how it all goes.

Thanks, again, for your help.

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Mon 17.02.2014, 14:14

How much did they charge? I used the worst price quote I got when I started doing the cables and added 20%, so I should have been high, not low. When I order in quantity, the price is really a lot less than that.

I will order a set of metric cables when I place my next order so I have them if anyone else has a problem.
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Mon 17.02.2014, 16:47

Actually, John they weren't that bad at £71.74 plus VAT plus carriage (£15.00). So total of £101.09.

The lesson, of course, is don't buy second hand; though, I suspect, I still made a considerable saving on the deal albeit with a load more pain which without the input of yourself, and others, would've been even more painful.

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Tue 18.02.2014, 12:13

Well I've no complaints about Cable-tec on their turnaround times - Cable arrived (with a black shroud so I hope it's right) at 11.00 am so less than 24hrs from order to delivery!
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Tue 18.02.2014, 15:43

If they used Felsted parts, they should have been mauve but maybe that is why they were so much more dear. The black jacket is more expensive.

Measure the total length and inner jacket length to make sure it is correct. Also "feel" the cable movement to make sure the cable moves freely and not like the previous cable. Better to measure now and find a problem before finding a problem while installing.

Since the other cable worked OK as far as adjustment is concerned, use the old cable to determine how far the crossgate rod end needs to be threaded down the rod by pulling the inner cable with rod end away from the jacket, measure the distance of the jam nut to the stepped adapter's outer face. Also measure how much of the outer jacket's thread is sticking through the stepped adapter so you can match that measurement too.This makes it easier to duplicate the previous adjustments.

When you are happy with the cable, assemble the shifter end. Match the position of the stepped adapter to where it was on the original cable. Pull the assembled rod end away from the outer jacket and adjust the rod end to match the above measurement to the stepped adapter. Secure the rod end with the lock nut.

Install the cable into the shifter assembly. Remember to put the cable through the hole in the shifter assembly. It sounds crazy, but in the heat of the assembly, I have forgotten a few times and had to take it back apart. Try to get the big snap ring to fit securely.

Try to find a couple of 6mm spring lock washers. A local hardware or DIY shop should have them. If you have a local shop you are friendly with, ask them for 2 washers. When attaching the rod end to the crossgate lever, put one of the washers on either side of the rod end: Put the bolt thru the hole in the lever, from the center outward. As it gets through the lever, put one spring lock washer on the bolt and then place the rod end over the screw. Put the other spring lock washer on the screw and then the lock nut and tighten.

The spring lock washers improve the rotational range of the rod end.

You know the drill from here. Push the cables thru the tunnel into the engine bay and keeping the crossgate cable at the bottom, route the cables to the gearbox and reassemble that section. When finished, the cables should always center.

Good luck.
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby epipete » Tue 26.05.2015, 11:44

image.jpg


Bit of a resurrection!

The other day I found I only had 1st,3rd and 5th gear, I suspected a loose linkage some where, and on dismantling this was proven correct!

The Nuts on the linkage side of the brackets have worked loose (one was completely off, the other just loosening).

They're a bugger to get to; does anyone know what size these nuts are as I don't think I have the right size spanner? Been trying with an adjustable spanner, the top is now tight but the lower one is impossible to get at!

Pete
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Re: Coolant supply

Postby muley » Tue 26.05.2015, 11:53

I think they came with a special spanner if they are from the source in Essex.

The spanner was short - whether it was a standard size though, I'm not sure. Maybe 17mm.?


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Re: Coolant supply

Postby HJ2 » Tue 26.05.2015, 14:53

I thought they were regular spanners size.
These are Bob's cables right?
As i recall it is 24 mm.

If you got a spare one, you can cut it to length.
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Re: Gear cable issues

Postby Brit-Car-Nut » Tue 26.05.2015, 22:17

The nuts on A-B, Bob's and my cables are all SAE 15/16 inch. Anyone that got a set of A-B or my cables got a pair of wrenches with their kits. Check the cables thread and see if anyone around you has a set to loan. I have extras but the shipping time doesn't make them very helpful. 15/16" is close enough to use a 24mm wrench cut down.
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