Phantom project

[dapinky]

There seems to be plenty of 'for and against' arguements so far (i love a healthy debate!), but without going too far off topic and throwing hypothetical theories into the pot, the simple question was asked about making the car go faster....


....we all know that Costas & the sh4rk went down the route that has been lusted after and partially emulated elsewhere, but if Dave wants a different approach, then it is a valid project......

...personally, i would keep the original, but I have done a number of different powerplant swaps in my time, sometimes just to show that it is possible, sometimes for power, sometimes for balance.

It all really depends on what the vehicle is for (if anything other than an engineering 'can-it-be-done' project), how 'original' it should be kept, how much cash you can throw at it, and a myriad of other variables.

Whatever the outcome, good luck to you Dave, I'm sure some will slate you for whatever you do, but hey, it's your time!

[GeoffSmith]

I'm sure some will slate you for whatever you do, but hey, it's your time!

I wouldn't have thought so.

[surfboardfiller]

PS what are you planning to use the fastcat for?

I'm going to adversely affect the weight of the car and un balance it without consulting Lotus at the cost of, well, £1000's I suppose.

[DaveT]

OK now I've got you started I'll fill you in.

As a number of the east Mids crew know I have been looking for a project car for some months- and yes if I'd have realised I was going to do this I would have repaired CJD, but its too late for that now.

One of my ex's sourced an MOT failure M100 through trade and I agreed to buy "subject to conditions". The car was not only an MOT failure- it was in the worst state possible requiring £5K just to sort out basic stuff. I declined the offer and its staying in the shed where it will no doubt expire. Its a scrapper and they want too much for it.

Hence, I have decided that I'll use my current car as the project, unless something else comes up in the interim. It is going for testing at the engineers this week and we will then start to look at the alternatives.

Yes, I am looking at a car which will not only be a road car but one that will prove to be a good track car as well. I am not looking to race in the true sense of the word but do want something that will out perform the stock set up.

Whilst I have been unemployed I have spent many hours reviewing all of your posts and looking at your ideas-

My overview of the picture is that with the M100 as is, there is a strict limit to what you can achieve with the car without getting into serious difficulties and stretching the envelopes too far. You then have the alternative of either significant alteration to the existing engine, turbo, charge cooler, ecm, etc. or sticking something totally different in the front. This is why its going to the race engineers- so they can decide what is possible with what we have and what could be achieved with something different.

I note Phils comments about the Toyota engine and tranny but costs make that not viable unless we can find a crashed Exige. Other options are clearly Honda 2.0L vtec or a Saab both of which will fit the bill. We have already looked at the torque steer problems and intend to deal with that as a separate issue.
I neither want a car that has continual problems and requires continual attention/repair which I cannot do myself and dont want to have to pay for, nor do I want a car that has so many custom built components that if anything goes wrong it is either off the road for weeks or new parts are either difficult or impossible to find.

There are several other non engine issues that are to be addressed as well. Suspension, brakes, respray.

I will let you know what is discussed and how things work out. Should have the first set of tests done within the fortnight.

[paulwatkins]

.......but do want something that will out perform the stock set up.

Fit an Everest chip!.....that'll be a good starting point

You could of done with that in Jurby!

[GeoffSmith]

I'm going to adversely affect the weight of the car

So you DO know the criteria!

[Gazza]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/336490.htm

Gazza

[surfboardfiller]

I think it should be noted that the Toyota engine in the Exige has been modified by lotus to give a much higher BHP than the standard Toyota cars.

Buying a Celica engine (Charged or not) is not going to give you the BHP of the Exige S.
The standard Celica engine can only match the M100. IMHO DONT BOTHER unless it's been tuned by lotus!

[rip]

RWD is inherently more able to put more power down to the road than FWD. Equal and opposite forces/turning moments and all that - viewing it from the offside, the wheels are applying the torque clockwise and the body is trying to turn anticlockwise so the downwards force due to the mass of the car is transferred to the rear wheels. QED.

This is illustrated in reverse when it comes to stopping. The weight is thrown forward and the rears can be easily locked if not kept in check, which is why most of the brake upgrades are for the front only.

[surfboardfiller]

I'm going to adversely affect the weight of the car

So you DO know the criteria!

I invent my own criteria! Knowledge is useless without the balls to use it.

[GeoffSmith]

Too much blue sky thinking Phil.

[ailwyn]

Now now children!

[surfboardfiller]

Too much blue sky thinking Phil.

You would say that mr follow the stupid crowd

[DaveT]

Without lateral thinking we wouldnt have got where we are today, so dont knock it.

Can we please stick to the point and keep the ideas coming as they really are useful in moving things forward.

[dapinky]

Can we please stick to the point .....

[Dico]

Can we please stick to the point .....

[DaveT]

Can we please stick to the point .....

I thought that was good too!!!!

[chris.t]

it's your car Dave, but personally i wouldn't do it. Surely to get a car which has more possible variations would be a more viable project. I don't know your budget but surely something mid engine RWD would be better (now i've done it ). Don't get me wrong, the Elan is a great car on the road, but i'm not sure that unless you spend mega bucks on it you will get anywhere near the performance you will need to make it competitive on track.

Monty has done a good job on his car but can he compete with an exige? I'll let Monty answer that one!

I'll be modding the VX in the next month or so. New exhaust, induction, springs, dampers, anti roll bar, and a remap of the ecu. Still i reckon that the best improvement to performance that i can do is to lose 2 stone and that will cost me nothing and is applicable to all cars!

[surfboardfiller]

it's your car Dave, but personally i wouldn't do it. Surely to get a car which has more possible variations would be a more viable project. I don't know your budget but surely something mid engine RWD would be better (now i've done it ). Don't get me wrong, the Elan is a great car on the road, but i'm not sure that unless you spend mega bucks on it you will get anywhere near the performance you will need to make it competitive on track.

Monty has done a good job on his car but can he compete with an exige? I'll let Monty answer that one!

He doesn't want to buy an Exige though. Just wants an M100 he can show off in and take his young lady friends out in. I'd love an M100 with a big V8 throbbing away, it would be like owning a TVR but it would be a really good car as well (can you imagine)!

[DaveT]

Hi Chris
Thing is I dont particularly want to compete against other cars which can obviously out perform the Elan and yes I would like an Exige- it is on my list but I would like to see if the Elan could go where lotus failed to take it- or should I say where they were not allowed to take it. I am not looking to a FWD version as I dont think that is within my pocket or within the capability of the lump, but I do think that resolving the torque steer problem, the weight distribution and the power down problem can be attacked from a different angle, and that with newer engines is possibly more achievable than it was in 1988.