Phantom project

[DaveT]

Don't get me wrong Just wants an M100 he can show off in and take his young lady friends out in.

WHO BLABBED

[chris.t]

Does anyone know if there was a 0-60-0 and or 0-100-0 times done for Costas's car as a matter of interest. I have been lead to believe that sub 6 sec 0-60 times are difficult to achieve due to the point GS made re FWD cars lifting at the front on acceleration. Might be wrong though!

[surfboardfiller]

Don't get me wrong Just wants an M100 he can show off in and take his young lady friends out in.

WHO BLABBED

I know you and I know girls, they don't want to sit in a cold bucket to be taken out to dinner, well not the nice ones.

[Monty]

Monty has done a good job on his car but can he compete with an exige? I'll let Monty answer that one!

In a word Not a Chance and not even an standard elise in the right hands there made for the track.

Saying that i still think Pinky needs more work on the suspension set up and in the right hands someone else could get more out of the M100 on the track. But I do it for fun and just enjoy having a laugh and hopefully i don`t push my luck

IMHO 260 HP sauce would be plenty, which the stock engine can take.

I`d only change the suspension if your going to do trackdays etc as the ride quality for normal driving is very hard

For track, concerntrate on
Simple engine mods to start with
Brakes (these will get you faster round the track)
Sticky tyres
lose some weight
suspension set up
Racing seats
Harness

and get out on track, get the feel for the car. Have a play with tyre pressure and suspension set up.

Then when you think the car handles well and you need more power go for the turbo upgrade.

[DaveT]

Thanx for the input Monty but having read the post of yourself and others I still wonder whether the car can cope with the additional power? For instance, how many times have you changed your cylinder head gasket? Does the clutch need to be changed?

What I dont want to do is go down the route of having to do one fix after another cos a job would have been better done at the start. Thats why I started this thread cos I'm wanting to coordinate the whole jumble into some sort of order and have it done to spec at the onset. Its identifying the spec that is part of the problem.

For those of you who talk about the weight distribution of the car- What came first? The design for the weight or the weight and then the design?
Having chatted to some guys who worked on the project the engine was chosen partly cos they couldnt control the torque steer of the larger 1800 option and partly cos they were only given the two options anyway. The weight of the two engines was almost the same. So they got stuck with a lump which then determined the weight of the car and its distribution. Nearly 70% of the weight therefore lies over the front axle. The front suspension was then designed to cope with this and the torque steer.

Now control of torque steer can be achieved and there are a multitude of engines which would fit the bill and just as reliably as the Isuzu, one has to wonder - What would Lotus have done had their options been open and available today?

[ailwyn]

I realise this defeats the object of your plan (i.e. fitting a different engine) but why not just get the car stripped into component parts, refurb, recondition or replace everything, and you end up with a like new M100? Sounds to me like you'd be looking at about this cost just to replace the engine & gearbox.

They have been on the road now for 18 years so why would reliability be a problem? The reason that most of the M100 are having runs of issues are due to their age

[DaveT]

I intend to have an Elan kept as close to standard as poss- just waiting for Dave Eds to sell me the yellow one when he gets desparate.

I havent decided that an engine change is definite but even if I keep the original it will be altered significantly- the same effect by different method.

[rip]

In a word Not a Chance and not even an standard elise in the right hands there made for the track.

A friend of mine used to own an Elise. He was amazed when I told him I found my Elan comfy on a long journey because his Elise was so uncomfortable and hard work that it forced him to stop for a break after about an hour's driving. I look on Exige's/Elise's simply as road-legal track cars.

[chris.t]

thing is you can pick up an early elise for reasonable money now and it will be over halfway there for a decently setup track car over an Elan. Weight and weight distribution issues will disappear, torque steer will not occur (well i hope not ). you can then concentrate on brakes,tweaking suspension and maybe honda/audi lump. Just think you'll be chasing the end of the rainbow with the Elan Dave!

On the road, the Elan is in its element which we all know but tracking it has its limits IMHO.

Cheers C

edit - have you been on track in an Elise?

[DaveT]

thing is you can pick up an early elise for reasonable money now and it will be over halfway there for a decently setup track car over an Elan. Weight and weight distribution issues will disappear, torque steer will not occur (well i hope not ). you can then concentrate on brakes,tweaking suspension and maybe honda/audi lump. Just think you'll be chasing the end of the rainbow with the Elan Dave!

On the road, the Elan is in its element which we all know but tracking it has its limits IMHO.

Cheers C

edit - have you been on track in an Elise?

Basically dont want an Elise or Exige and dont want a specific track car of one or the other. If I wanted a specific track car I'd be going for a Lotus 7- £8.9K all in, no mods needed. I want an improved Elan road car which I can occasionally take on track but more importantly take to places like the IOM and Europe and the USA!!!!!! to boldly go where no Elan has gone before.

and yes I have been on track in an Elise and an Exige and a Europa - new one.

Unlike most of what has been done to date- I dont want to push the envelope that already exists I want to redraw the envelope.

D

[Paul.P]

Unlike most of what has been done to date- I dont want to push the envelope that already exists I want to redraw the envelope.

D

Dave, whether what you wish is achievable without spending a fortune, we'll have to wait & see, but i wish you good luck with your endevour. If nothing else its adding interest to a some what boring forum at the minute.
Please add exciting posts along the way, like Costas did !

Oh, & is Redraw actually a word, or is it something you scousers say ?

[chris.t]

thing is you can pick up an early elise for reasonable money now and it will be over halfway there for a decently setup track car over an Elan. Weight and weight distribution issues will disappear, torque steer will not occur (well i hope not ). you can then concentrate on brakes,tweaking suspension and maybe honda/audi lump. Just think you'll be chasing the end of the rainbow with the Elan Dave!

On the road, the Elan is in its element which we all know but tracking it has its limits IMHO.

Cheers C

edit - have you been on track in an Elise?

Basically dont want an Elise or Exige and dont want a specific track car of one or the other. If I wanted a specific track car I'd be going for a Lotus 7- £8.9K all in, no mods needed. I want an improved Elan road car which I can occasionally take on track but more importantly take to places like the IOM and Europe and the USA!!!!!! to boldly go where no Elan has gone before.

and yes I have been on track in an Elise and an Exige and a Europa - new one.

Unlike most of what has been done to date- I dont want to push the envelope that already exists I want to redraw the envelope.

D

ah right i see where you're coming from (at last). Don't take this the wrong way, how about learning how to drive the car faster, may work out cheaper

[rip]

I hear Dave has 2 driving modes: a restrained one for the road (because his status as a driving instructor is too precious to jeopardise by getting a speeding ticket) and another for the track when all hell breaks loose.

[chris.t]

I hear Dave has 2 driving modes: a restrained one for the road (because his status as a driving instructor is too precious to jeopardise by getting a speeding ticket) and another for the track when all hell breaks loose.

ah but does the car break loose??!! with a little tuition on lift off oversteer, healing toeing technique etc etc extra speed can be obtained without any mods to the car, just a thought.

[DaveT]

Thanx for the advice on driving faster Chris but as you know fast driving on track and roads is totally different. I learnt fast driving on roads in 1976 and have taught it and updated my skills ever since. I have also had tuition on track driving but not as much practice as I would like. I'd like some more tuition and a lot more practice. I have also learnt to drive within the law, and as Rip says, needs must.

[chris.t]

8)

Thanx for the advice on driving faster Chris but as you know fast driving on track and roads is totally different. I learnt fast driving on roads in 1976 and have taught it and updated my skills ever since. I have also had tuition on track driving but not as much practice as I would like. I'd like some more tuition and a lot more practice. I have also learnt to drive within the law, and as Rip says, needs must.

I remember seeing a promotional film for the Elan (cue Dave Speck to find it) where this guy was on track showing what the car could do. He took it through a salom of cones at some speed and the car looked so poised. there was also a shot of him going round a corner without the expected understeer which made me think that he must have been using a technique such as lift-off oversteer to do it. Wish i could do it!

Not knocking your driving prowess Dave, just that i know that for me i could get the car lapping faster if i had a lot more driving skill.

[Dave Eds]

just that i know that for me i could get the car lapping faster if i had a lot more driving skill.

Same goes for me Chris. I had intended to do a beginners track session at Snetterton this weekend rather than track on my own later in the month. I know I could have done better than I did at Jurby, and want to improve up there this year.

[chris.t]

just that i know that for me i could get the car lapping faster if i had a lot more driving skill.

Same goes for me Chris. I had intended to do a beginners track session at Snetterton this weekend rather than track on my own later in the month. I know I could have done better than I did at Jurby, and want to improve up there this year.

I'm sure you will.

I have often thought about letting a professional driver loose on my car. But i'm loathed to give my car to someone to really rag round a track but i would really like to see how a good driver would deal with my car and then to get his comments on where he thinks improvements can be made.

[GeoffSmith]

He took it through a salom of cones at some speed and the car looked so poised.

There's also this one.

[Ellie]

I found a couple of cents in m' pocket and put 'em in the lateral thinking meter. I'm a tinkerer, not an expert.

The subframe below the engine limits sump position amongst other things like low-slung weights, so by-passing engines already suggested, there's the Hyabusa or other small, low weight, high output motorcycle engines (lotsa room to reach the oil filter!), or if you wanted to be really different (dare I say unique 'cos I've not seen it at LEC) cut a hole in the bonnet [hood] and stick a 'blower' or 'birdcatcher' through it on top of the standard or other engine (one for Geoff's photoshop methinks).

Continuing laterally & upward, compare the weights between the standard hood and the hardtop(s) available, maybe there's some savings to be had there. Lightweight carbon/fibreglass raceday seats instead of those lovely comfy factory ones may save some weight too. Rollbar may cost weight though.

Ding! The meter expired.