Got my Lotus Elan Yesterday!!

[TrueBlue]

yes monty normally i would have driven it back
but trading standards have said not to drive it because it has to go back in the same condition
if i drive it then the dealer 'could' say that the things that are wrong occurred whilst i was driving it
also there are 2 or 3 warnings apparently on the engines computer and it has no bulb in it so i shouldnt drive it it might not be safe is another reason... i could take it easy which i am willing to do but trading standards advise not to...

i am awaiting a call from trading standards to tell me if the dealer has an obligation to pick up the vehicle or what they expect me to do...

Trading standards have said they want to take action against the dealer and will do so if i do not get the re-fund

to be honest i dont care anymore
i'm quite happy to sell it cheap and for the dealer to get done by TS
he shouldnt have with-held info from me in the first place...

Richard

[rip]

Sounds like TS are giving you good support. With them on your side, you may get a result.

I can't blame you being completely fed up and just wanting to see the back of the Elan.

[chris.t]

I have just picked up on this thread, i normally assume that a newbie thread is all about "what does this do....", ".... what a great drive should have bought one sooner" - how wrong could i be. Really sorry to hear you've had all this trouble. If you have a friend with a vehicle with a tow hook you could hire a trailer. If you do go up there i would take a couple of your more 'capable' friends with you just in case. without trying to be alarmist, there are some right nutters out there, believe me!

Do hope you manage to sort this one out and glad Clemo has got you a car thats kosher. Take care m8.

Cheers Chris

[TrueBlue]

thanks for that advice chris

i rang the garage again today and said i couldnt find a delivery driver
and asked if they could pick it up and he said yes they can and will arrange it and call me back with a date/time

so i am very happy about this

Trading standards said to write to him again recorded delivery to confirm this agreement and the date, and that the money must be re-imbursed by cash/draft etc before the vehicle is taken away and before the documents/proof! are returned..
so it is all agreed and confirmed in writing before it is done...

so anyway i am happy it has gone smoothly despite my worrying and much thanks to those who helped once again

i relapsed on my smoking yesterday and had 7 cigarettes.. but then realised how horrible it made me feel, thew the pack away and have managed to continue stopping...so thats good...
i dont really think the elan is a smokers car..

[chris.t]

i relapsed on my smoking yesterday and had 7 cigarettes.. but then realised how horrible it made me feel, thew the pack away and have managed to continue stopping...so thats good...
i dont really think the Elan is a smokers car..

I wouldn't say that, Dico lights up his tyres and smokes em at every opportunity

[Enright]

And when's the last time THAT happened?!?

[chris.t]

And when's the last time THAT happened?!?

in Germany i think when we went to the Nurburgring. Think there were some girlies he wanted to impress The car as hitting the rev limiter while he was doing it. Made me cringe

[TrueBlue]

thanks for that advice chris

i rang the garage again today and said i couldnt find a delivery driver
and asked if they could pick it up and he said yes they can and will arrange it and call me back with a date/time

so i am very happy about this

Trading standards said to write to him again recorded delivery to confirm this agreement and the date, and that the money must be re-imbursed by cash/draft etc before the vehicle is taken away and before the documents/proof! are returned..
so it is all agreed and confirmed in writing before it is done...

so anyway i am happy it has gone smoothly despite my worrying and much thanks to those who helped once again
..

well ive just had a call for the guy at the dealers
shouting at me, accusing me of sending him threatening letters, telling me to 'shut my cakebox' or i'll find myself in big trouble(in court)
he said now you listen to me -when that car is on our premises then...
I HUNG UP !!

i dont like being shouted at and to shut my cakebox...
i sent him the letters because thats what trading standards said to do

so now i will have to call trading standards and also goto the county court
to make an application...i will need a solicitor because i am not willing to show my face in court as i am now afraid that violence may happen after all his shouting...

[ailwyn]

The guy is probably blowing off steam, but if you feel that there is a real danger to yourself or anyone else from this guy, go to the police.

Can't really see him going out of his way to give you a hiding especially as that would be the first place the police would look

I think you should get back in touch with the guy tomorrow and confirm that your arrangement to have the car collected still stands, if he wants to rant and rave, then so be it, just keep your cool and stick to business.

[TrueBlue]

The guy is probably blowing off steam, but if you feel that there is a real danger to yourself or anyone else from this guy, go to the police.

Can't really see him going out of his way to give you a hiding especially as that would be the first place the police would look

I think you should get back in touch with the guy tomorrow and confirm that your arrangement to have the car collected still stands, if he wants to rant and rave, then so be it, just keep your cool and stick to business.

yes ailwyn
he says he is happy to give refund but says he wants the car at his premises to check it over before i get a refund...
I am not happy with this
1. he could cause arguments about who caused the cars condition or deny that it left him with this fault etc
2. therefore I might not get my money back
3. once he has the car then it makes it more difficult for me to take legal action not having any evidence

i am going to take him to small calims court, its the only way i can see myself getting the money back without this being a problem

or if i can get 4k for the car i will do that and it will save me the hassle
it has new wishbones etc...there are some quite good things about the car
the elec windows are very good etc

[RayD]

Richard you have overdone it with the sherry…

Your second letter has rubbed him up the wrong way…the one Trading Standards suggested you send.

I can’t remember you ever saying you had seen the car before buying it. In any event you had it delivered to the door. It had a number of faults which caused you to have it checked over. It had a service book belonging to another car and the warning light bulbs purposely removed – not necessarily by the person you bought it from – to give the appearance of being in order, when it clearly wasn’t.

The seller agreed to give you a full refund on its return. You couldn’t find a delivery person at an acceptable price so the seller said he would see to it.

Someone could think he is being reasonable.

If he was insisting on the car being back on his premises before he made the bank transfer – which is not unreasonable - then you would have to trust he would keep his end of the bargain. Especially as you don’t feel inclined to travel to Nottingham to make sure he did.

You need to look upon it as though you were taking something back to Marks and Spenser’s. You wouldn’t expect them to send someone round with the money before they saw your salmon en croute. He’s not buying the car from you.

You need to get back to where you were – before the phone call – and as I suggested earlier, you need to liaise with someone before taking the plunge. For this sort of thing you are too….something, I’m not sure what the something is, but it doesn’t lend itself to arguing the toss over a duff Lotus Élan.

Ray

[Monty]

Like i said this should of all been done over the phone and only if the guy was being difficult thats u should of sent letters and if that didn`t work thats when u go to trading standards. Obviously the guy has taken offence to your approch and more than likely make the proccess more difficult.

You have to take a bit of responsibility here, as soon as the garage said to bring the car back you should of been there ASAP even if u had to pay for it to be transported (i would of drove it) better losing a couple of hundred than thousands

Get back on the phone to him and get it sorted, no point going on about selling it when u`r in dispute with the garage.

BTW if the Elan is as bad as u make out you won`t even get 3k for it

[TrueBlue]

:agree:

Like i said this should of all been done over the phone and only if the guy was being difficult thats u should of sent letters and if that didn't work thats when u go to trading standards. Obviously the guy has taken offence to your approch and more than likely make the proccess more difficult.

You have to take a bit of responsibility here, as soon as the garage said to bring the car back you should of been there ASAP even if u had to pay for it to be transported (i would of drove it) better losing a couple of hundred than thousands

Get back on the phone to him and get it sorted, no point going on about selling it when u'r in dispute with the garage.

BTW if the Elan is as bad as u make out you won't even get 3k for it

monty the reason why ive been taking advice from trading standards and writing to them and now taking legal steps
instead of just ringing
is because : when u receive a car that is supposed to have just had a full service
and then find out that it has no water in it and a missing warning bulb...when this happens
is one really supposed to trust the dealer

NO is my answer

i lost faith and trust in the dealer the moment i saw what had happened
trusting them to re-fund my money is not an option in my case based on my experience with them so far..

i will take it to court and let trading standards take the action they want to take

i will get 3750 in auto trader as a project car...if i dont get my money back in court

[ailwyn]

i will get 3750 in auto trader as a project car...if i dont get my money back in court

Well you need to decide which route you are taking as there is no point in starting court action if you are trying to sell the car.

If you do try and sell the car then the dealer wins and has a come-back in court - "he just decided he didn't want the car, couldn't sell it, and has now brought this action to try to make us pay for it"

Just my thoughts

A.

[RayD]

Richard,

Here’s the simplified version….

It’s only a matter of getting the car 234 miles from Torquay to Nottingham – reversing the damage done by the second letter (special tools may be required) – and receiving £5000.

It could all be over by 5 pm on Monday.

The alternatives don’t bear thinking about. It would go on forever, and you would lose out.

Ray

[theelanman]

[dapinky]

Richard,

It seems that you are trying to have 2 bites of the cherry here.

Whilst we all sympathise with the whole situation, you need to decide which route you are now going to take.

You either get the car back to the dealer and receive £5K - either taking a small loss on the delivery yourself, or trusting the dealer to collect and then re-imburse you. (Preferred option IMHO).
Or you keep the car and do with it what you will (sell, break or use it).

BUT what you can't do is sell it off to get something back, and then still expect the dealer to give you £5K at court.

The court will take the view that the dealer has offered a reasonable way of dealing with it all and you are not complying. They may then award all the costs spent out by the dealer against you, and you'll be more out of pocket!

If you sell the car for £3k in the meantime, the court will assume that you are happy to have kept the car, and will be unlikely to find in your favour - they will not make up your losses - as the dealer would then be well out of pocket, if there had been a total lack of effort on his part it may be different, but he has tried to make it good (but you arn't happy with it - not his fault).

So far the dealer has taken everything he has been told at face value (I'm not saying that Clemo's report, or the listed faults are in any way fabrication!) and offered a solution - He's actually being more than fair!

Just because you don't feel able to comunicate in a forceful but controlled manner with him, doesn't make him wrong.

If you want to take him to court, that is up to you, but (as previously advised by lots of people) you will need to have the car 'officially' examined, kept as evidence and eventually either crushed (if unroadworthy) or returned to the dealer if he wants it back. You can't just sell it on in the meantime and still hope to win. Courts have rules of evidence, and you haven't actually got any at the moment

Final comment is that you really need to have a good hard think, decide what you are going to do, & get on with it.
You need to summon up the moral courage to 'phone the guy up, eat a bit of humble pie, appologise if he took the letter the wrong way, explain that you were acting on TS advice but now realise that this was, perhaps, a little unnecessary.
See if you can go back to plan 'A' and have the car collected.
YOU WILL THEN EXPECT A FULL REFUND ONCE HE HAS THE CAR BACK AT HIS PREMISES.
(You may wish to record the conversation, so you will have some evidence (not necessarily the same as proof) if he should renege on the deal.

A lot of people on here have given up time and effort, and offered assistance to you, but it all becomes pointless if you won't take the advice and accept the offers of help. We can't do it for you, but will offer support where we can.

[RayD]

Richard,

Having read a couple of your recent posts and seeing you are back on form, have you made any progress with the refund on your Nottingham Elan?

Ray

[clemo]

lots has happened but nothing can be said as case is very much ongoing.

all will be told once settled..

[RayD]

Any news yet?
Ray