Stalled - no restart - after 5 mins, short run time - SORTED

[dapinky]

I've tried a few searches and cant find a thread worth adding to (sorry if there is one!)

The problem is as per title - Angie came home from work the other day, parked the car (facing downhill) and it stalled. It would not re-start for a while, then it did, but died again after about 5 seconds.

I went out to it a bit later and it fired up first time, idled for a while, so i drove off - 50 yds later, stalled again & failed to restart.

Got it home after a couple of hours of leaving it, but it stalled again!!!!

Same again today......

.....here's what it does, and what I've done....

When it runs, it seems fine, so I've ruled out a major mechanical failure.

That leaves fuel and sparks...

Spark plugs are fine (but dry), and i get a spark when conected in free air & cranking engine (so I was thinking petrol here).

The pump seems okay as i can hear it running for the usual couple of seconds when i turn on ignition, and it still runs when the engine dies (so I'm assuming the relay is okay).

I connected a spare piece of fuel pipe to the tank outlet, and when operating the ignition, it put about a cup full of fuel into a bucket before turning off.

The fuel seems okay (ie, it's petrol, not diesel or water!).

Put it all back together, and no change

It definately feels like no fuel is getting to the engine, but when it runs it runs fine and suddenly dies without a missfire (so i assume all injectors are working, otherwise it would only be on 2 cylinders).

Where do i go next??????? Fuel rail? pressure regulator? anywhere else?

[DaveB]

So it seems fine when cold?

Any warning lights etc...?

Have you scanned it?

[dapinky]

Temperature seems to make no difference.

No CEL.

Doesn't want to run long enough to elanscan it (but i'll have another go tomorrow).

[Specky]

Thinking out loud..

Blocked fuel filter

s**t in the carb

I also wonder if it's ECU related, A sensor telling it to over fuel or underfuel

I'll have a think...

TTFN

[dapinky]

Blocked fuel filter

I thought about that, but can't understand why it would pass fuel to start with (but this problem did start just after filling up with petrol from a nearly empty tank - I'll try to undo the pipe at the engine end and see how much comes through.

s**t in the carb

If the above doesn't work, I'll try this one

I also wonder if it's ECU related, A sensor telling it to over fuel or underfuel

I wondered about that, but wouldn't know where'how to start looking (I suppose swapping for the one in the blue car is as good a place as any to start).

I'll have a think...

Can't ask for more than that

[Specky]

I don't think transposing the ECU's is the way forward... cos sods law says it'll be sensor...

But hey...you'll never know if you don't

TTFN

[GeoffSmith]

Blocked filter - primed before starting then not able to maintain flow?
Fuel pump stopping due to vibration?
Inefficient fuel pump?
One to go with Specky's carb theory..... Have you checked to see if there is fuel in the bowl?

Yep, smacks of fuel starvation

[Paul.P]

I had a similar thing with whitey Dave, it was a relay, but can't remember which one, Kelvedon motors replaced it, it was only about £8, is there a fuel cut relay ?

[GeoffSmith]

Fuel pump stopping due to vibration?

I had a similar thing with whitey Dave, it was a relay, but can't remember which one, Kelvedon motors replaced it, it was only about £8, is there a fuel cut relay ?

Bingo!

[dapinky]

But the relay must be okay, otherwise it wouldn't pump any fuel (would it????)

Or are we saying that it could be wobbly when the engine runs?

Do i short out the connectors to try it (or just take one from the other car)?

[GeoffSmith]

Probably corroded contacts which get a bit resistive / wobbly with vibration!

You should find a similar one elsewhere on the car but ideally swap it over to yours first to prove the theory.

[dapinky]

It's probably a stupid question at this time of night ('cos no-one is likely to have one to hand), but is it a 'standard' relay that i can get from anywhere, or is it specific to the car?

Is it likely to be visible corrosion, or inside the 'black box'? - or inside the holder, where the pins go?

If it isn't a standard part, can a standard one be used???? (with an appropriate socket, obviously) - I have a 'spare' Ford Onion fusebox with lots of relays in it somewhere in the garage (i had it for the Dolomite)??

[GeoffSmith]

Common or garden - the same as the horn, rear fog light and blower fan slow relays:

[dapinky]

Okay, I've had a day of scratched knuckles and scratching head.......

....ruled out the relay early on by swapping for the one in blue car - blue one ran, red one didnt!

Swapped out the fuel filter (hasn't been in there long, but you never know) - I'd forgotten how little room there is with roll bars fitted

Emptied the tank out (short out the relay to allow pump to run, then connect a hose to the tank outlet into a suitable container - well, the other way round actually, obviously!) put a new gallon of super unleaded in, pumped it round the system to dispel air bubbles and then fired it up......

....it ran for about 15 seconds, with throttle response, and all 4 cylinders.

Then it died again

Tried to test the injectors (but don't know what I'm doing) - they all had ~2.6 ohms impedence, as did the 2 on my spare engine which i checked.

Hopefully, it might start up later long enough to try and get a scan.

Oh, and there are no codes stored.

And I swapped the ECU for the blue one - no difference.

Any more ideas??????

[Dave Eds]

long shot Pinks - are all the rubber vacuum pipes in place and in tact?

[Specky]

When it dies, will it restart after it's primed it self

TTFN

[dapinky]

long shot Pinks - are all the rubber vacuum pipes in place and in tact?

I think so!

When it dies, will it restart after it's primed it self

TTFN

Nope - not til it's been left a while.

[Specky]

A sensor telling her to over fuel...

Temp and pressure first spring to mind...

Where's Geoff when you need him

TTFN

[RayD]

Is it worth putting the paper clip in when it does start to see...out of interest ...if it will continue running?

Ray

[dapinky]

Ray,

Tried that, but wasn't quick enough!

It only ever runs for about 4 or 5 seconds at the moment, and then it is all luck! - I will need to leave it now til tomorrow.

Luckily, i don't have a paperclip, I have a rocker switch in the glovebox - i have tried starting it in 'service mode' no different.

I have a couple of elanscan files (I can't call then runs, because it wasn't running!),

It is obvious when i am cranking the engine, and when it is 'recovering', however a couple of things leap out at me as being 'wrong' (ie, i wouldn't expect those results, but I've never done a log with just cranking the engine over before).......

IAC seems to have a base setting of 80......

....air/fuel ratio appears well low.....

so, basically i need to know what that lot means, and hopefully get a pointer to what is wrong! (and how to test it would be nice, otherwise it's just going to be lots of swap-overs).

no start.zip

no start 2.zip