Shorter & uprated Springs

[chrishewett]

I got the car back from Andy Waters last week.
After driving it for about 200 miles I can say that I am very pleased with the result. Although it is still comfortable on the road, as per the brief, it turns in much better and handles much better on the new stiffer springs. Harder bushes also help.
He has not gone for a radical change, Lotus made a pretty good job in the first place and I dont intend to trackday it much. However, if it was intended to use it mainly on track the springs would want to be 20% stiffer all round with a resulting harsher drive.
I am taking the car to Le Mans on saturday for ten days and so will be able to really test it out on some great french roads. I will report back with my feelings after a longer trial.
When I get back Andy will fit the new front brake calipers ( AP Racing Elise ) which it really needs.
Chris

[bobbrown]

Do you know what the spring rates are now and are they the same length as the standard springs?
e.g. if they are the same length and a stronger spring rate, all other things remain the same then they will raise the ride height.

Bob

[chrishewett]

Bob,
The fronts are standard rate and length. The rear are now the same rate as the front. Andy tried five different spring rates testing the car on an airfield. The rear has been lowered a tad.
It seems to work well. Andy Waters is more able to explain exactly what he did.
Chris

[bobbrown]

That makes very little sense to me as the standard rears are a little over half the rate of the fronts, and they are carrying about a third of the total weight. If this is supposed to be a good road setup then why did Lotus set the cars up the way they did?
Also on top of that did he keep the standard dampers or do you have some sort of adjustable dampers fitted?
If you have the standard dampers then they are not matched to the springs and even adjustables will not be ideally matched.

Bob

[chrishewett]

Bob,
You are obviously far better informed than me.
Maybe it would be better if you gave your opinion to Andy Waters. He only has 25 years experience in motorsport but he may be able to understand you better than me.
Sense does not have a "c" in it.
Chris

[Nige]

Would it be true that stiffening up the rear of the car (with either stiffer springs or a stiffer anti roll bar) would make the car have a greater tendency to oversteer and thus make the turn in feel sharper?

[RayD]

Nige, I think Chris answered this earlier...

.... it turns in much better and handles much better on the new stiffer springs.

Well done Chris, It sounds as though your man has done an excellent job.

Ray

[Nige]

Nige, I think Chris answered this earlier...

.... it turns in much better and handles much better on the new stiffer springs.

Well done Chris, It sounds as though your man has done an excellent job.

Ray

I know! I was making the connection with a stiffer rear end and therefore a greater tendency to oversteer with the sharper turn in reported by Chris.

It seems an unconventional approach that has been taken but if it works then I see nothing wrong in that.

[RayD]

I'm sorry Nige, I thought you were asking a question. Even reading it several times it still seems the same.

Ray

[Nige]

I'm sorry Nige, I thought you were asking a question. Even reading it several times it still seems the same.

Ray

No worries Ray, I did pose it as a question but I suppose it was rhetorical.

[chrishewett]

I have now driven the car 2,500 miles on the new setup. Most of this was on great french driving roads sometimes in torrential rain and sometimes in blistering sunshine. All the time I was following my brother in the elise. I had no trouble keeping up when driving fast although the elise would leave me behind on a tight track as it has a very stiff race setup.
At no time did I have any problem with oversteer, not even in the wet. It drives much more like a sportscar now but is still comfortable, obviously the stiffer rear springs are noticable but not too uncomfortable. I have noticed a bit of torque steer when accelerating hard, Andy puts this down to the harder bushes.
Basically I think this setup is more what lotus would have done if they hadn't felt the need to introduce understeer and a softer ride to accomodate Joe average driver.
To summarise, the car has new front springs and dampers, stiffer rear springs slightly lowered with appropriate length dampers, harder bushes in the lower wishbones ( the ones that do all the work) and the geometry has been altered.
This was not a very expensive job as Andy Waters has not charged for his time ( considerable, he had the car for nearly five months) in a trial and error approach.
In the thread on stiffer anti roll bars Bob Brown said -" You could do it the hard and often expensive way and try different settings to see which works best but it takes a long time to get it right."
This is exactly what Andy has done.
These are just my opinions and I am sure that a lot of you guys have much more experience and knowledge than me but I have trusted a guy who has a very good reputation with results to back up his approach and I am very happy.
He will be offering a range of packages to suit individual needs and no doubt will be advertising them. Meanwhile he is very approachable and is much better qualified to answer any questions or doubts than me.
Chris

[Monty]

Chris,

As long as your happy with the work thats the main thing and it sounds like quite an improvement too I suffer a lot off understeer on track which i think is down to the springs and AVO`s i fitted, so i`m looking forward to a new upgrade.
Hope you had a good time whizzing round France