Help rapid water loss

[epipete]

Hi, just driven from Chippenham to Leominster, a good 100 miles!

Parked the car in the car park, everything has been great, parked up and noticed a pooling of hot water just below the drivers door behind the front wheel. Result complete coolant loss.

Any ideas where this might be from, presumably a split hose, but which one?

And can I engineer a quick fix?

Pete

[theelanman]

heater valve/hose......or the control switch.....
maybe the matrix.........

bugger to get at.....sorry.....
guessing you'll need to be working upside down if you dont want to pull the dash

[theelanman]

I was talking b x

sorry see here for heater valve....

http://wikilec.9600.org/index.php/Heater_valve

[epipete]

Thank, should I be able to see this valve in the engine bay or is it behind the dash?

[theelanman]

engine bay...

[theelanman]

[epipete]

Brill,

So as a temp fix I could, assuming the leak is heater side, short circuit the hoses in the engine bay as a temporary fix?

Pete.

[theelanman]

never tried it but I dont see why not.....
all you would be doing is cutting out the heater matrix to the interior.......

[hodge]

you need to get under there with a light Pete to see more clearly where the leak is coming from.
The heater valve is on the other side of the car to the drivers door (it doesn't discount it tho as coolant will find point of least resistance so may well hit ground some way from source).
You'll probably need to fill the overflow tank to get the leak going strong again.
Pete

[bobbrown]

If it is driver’s side, back from the radiator it could be a number of things from the pump inlet hose to the radiator bye-pass pipe or the water pump. A piece of cardboard under the car should give a good indication if the area to look.

Bob

[epipete]

Guys, thanks for all your advice. Following on from my original post we refilled the water and carefully, & cautiously proceeded on the Aberystwyth regularly stopping to check water levels , which seemed to be holding with a minimum of loss. Yesterday I checked everything over before leaving Aber heading for Betys-e-coed well then it went pair shaped, lost 1 cylinder and intermittent fault in an other meant progress was pretty strained towards the destination - I put this down to wet coils from spilling water on topping up!

This morning wasn't any better so out with the AA, guy reckoned HGF although no oil etc in the water, I still hope for coils!

Came back on a flat back truck (at least I could take in the scenery)!

Strip down tomorrow to see if I'm lucky with a heaterside leak and failed coil or unlucky (having taken a risk ) with HGF!

Pete

[madbilly]

Hi Pete,
Have you tried tightening up every hose clip? I started having significant coolant loss and tightening up all the clips has stopped it.
When I had my breakdowndue to dodgy CAS-related ignition timing the AA decided my car had HGF too but they were completely incorrect. I know they're on the whole good at diagnosis but when it comes to the intricacies of a how a specific engine behaves, particuarly in fuelling and ignition, I don't think they have the time to think it through like garage mechanics, or us.
I hope that calms your fears!
Will

[epipete]

Ok, well the car runs all be it rough, it also seems to hold water at least while its cool!

Seems to me the action plan is:

1. Determine Spark (Coils, Leads, Plugs)
2. Locate leak (Hoses, Matrix, valves etc)
3. Rectify both, if issues found.
4. Test for HGF (The AA man suspects!)
5. HGF change as required.

If it gets as far as 5 then may have to think again, redundancy earlier this year didn't allow for massive bills on 'toys' however delightful

So, this a.m. I have run the car and, sequentially, removed and replaced, each ignition cable in turn.

No 1 cable separated the cable from the plastic sheaf and metal sleeve that connects to the plug (whether this was a poor connection before I pulled it I have no idea. I've done a 'fix' of this cable but as to it's real effectivness I can't be over confident, however on running the engine I do have a spark from it!) As I pull the cables; No 1 causes a reduction in revs but doesn't stall, least ways not immediately; Nos 2 & 3 appear to have no effect whatsoever and when I pull No 4 the engine stalls; in itself what is this telling me? Presumably that either the leads for 2 & 3 are defective (unlikely both) but that the associated coil is defective (most likely). How to test further?

The current leads are Magnacor KV85, 2.5 mil; no idea how old!

Pete

[GeoffSmith]

in itself what is this telling me? Presumably that either the leads for 2 & 3 are defective (unlikely both) but that the associated coil is defective (most likely). How to test further

Swap coil packs.

[epipete]

Again, thanks, I'll do that swap tomorrow.

Moving on to coolant, seems both sides under the seats, passenger side mainly, are saturated, well flooded actually! I haven't removed the dash yet but I'm still minded that the leak is the passenger side of the bulkhead!

The Samco hose set includes all the hoses for the heater side apparently but there is an ongoing debate about the length of various pipes so I shall hold off ordering until resolved

Geoff, you may recall we spoke about heater matrix at the last West Midland meet, do you have one that I might purchase please?

Pete

[madbilly]

I changed my leads when I had my misfire problem. Performance Leadsmade me up some new ones so they should have the measurements etc if you decide to get some.

[epipete]

Well it's been slow going (sidetracked with household decorating) but today fitted new coils and leads, finally assembled and installed the heater box with recored matrix, replaced the heater valve, topped up coolant, put the dash back in (whoever designed the heater control connector block should be shot) and fired up. Bliss firing on all 4 cylinders, sounds fine - but not yet tried out on the road (still need to install seats but need to address outrigger rust first!)

Couple of issues

Whilst It was all apart I installed a Headlamp Control Unit that I acquired last year as I have an intermittent problem with the original. As soon as I connected the battery the pods raised but didn't (and still won't) retract. Does this suggest a problem with the 'new' unit or some other issue? How do you wind the pods down?

Although hot water is going through the new matrix I have no functionality from the heater control so need to look at the vacuum hoses again, I still have one from the actuator behind the blower that I can't find a 'home' for but have raised this matter elsewhere, still any thoughts would be appreciated. I am reluctant to jack the car up because the outrigger problem has rusted out my jacking points so am unable to access the Vacuum Reservoir at present! Though I may attempt this tomorrow. Any thoughts rue this loose hose?

[Brit-Car-Nut]

First: You can jack by the suspension itself and put supports under the wheels or hubs as necessary to work safely under the car.

There are several headlamp controllers that look alike but don't all interchange. Is it possible you got one for the earlier design?

The early (pre 1987) Firebird and Fiero used an identical looking controller that will not interchange with the later version. Try to research the part number and see what car it really fits.

I will look to see if I can identify your vacuum hose question. --- I replied to your question under heater rebuild.

[epipete]

John

Again, thanks for your help. The light control unit that I put in was the one that you sent me a year ago so I'm sure that it is the correct model. I have switched the old one back in and, yes, if I tweak the wires the pods retract! So I have no idea if I have dud wiring/connectors/or controller, doh but at least I know that I can raise the pods when I'm out (though it does rather kill any pretensions to being cool particularly when attracting female company (I should be so lucky)).

The two units are alike, having only one number on them: 16509097.

As to your comments on the vacuum pipes I've picked up your message on my other thread, much appreciated.

Pete

[Brit-Car-Nut]

Pete: I know I tested the controller on my car before I sent it to you. You might want to use a dedicated contact cleaner on the two plugs to see if that helps. I know the controller is close by the bonnet ledge drain, so the connections probably get wet occasionally.