F1 formula one chat/stuff

[chipp]

Can't blaim Vettel for wanting to maximize his points tally, every one counts look at last season. Saying that, really looking forward to him being beaten fair and square. Got to feel sorry for Rosberg on the other hand, commendable. Seems a bit early in the season for team orders anything can happen between now and November.

chipp

[Rambo]

But he would have only lost 7 points to Webber and saved face. His sheer arrogance now means that in future Webber may not do him and the team any favours.

If Rosberg can do it, why can't Vettel ??

Everyone wants to see a race to the end but unfortunately orders are orders

[Rambo]

Analysis

Andrew Benson -Chief F1 writer

"The Malaysian Grand Prix team orders controversy at Red Bull is only the latest episode of a long-running drama between Sebastian Vettel and Mark Webber.

"It goes right back to 2010, when the two crashed while Vettel tried to pass Webber for the lead of the Turkish Grand Prix.

"Since then, there has been a litany of further incidents at the team as the two men, both intensely determined and tough but very different in other ways, have battled for supremacy.

"Adding spice to it is Webber's belief that, while they profess to allow them to battle it out on the track, the team is more behind Vettel than him.

"The belief - widely shared within F1 - is founded on the way the team have responded to the various situations between their drivers.

"In their battle in Malaysia there may even have been a bit of residual revenge on Vettel's part - the German and his champion at Red Bull, motorsport chief Helmet Marko, felt Webber was obstructive in last season's title-deciding Brazilian Grand Prix."

[chipp]

Yes, and for Vettel 7 points less would have mean't him not retaining his title.
If Webber now battles harder with his team mate and the red mist comes down, it could mean more exciting racing.
Hopefully more incidents would result in less points for the pair of them and other drivers will collect more points ending Red Bull's dominance for a fourth consecutive year.

chipp

[rip]

Seems a bit early in the season for team orders anything can happen between now and November.

Not really. If the Red Bulls had raced to the flag, they may have both overcooked their tyres & spun off. Webber could have earned the team all 43 points.
Similar goes for Mercedes. If Brawn had let them race or Rosberg had ignored orders, he could have caused them both to run out of fuel. They were telling Hamilton well before his final stint that he had to conserve fuel.

Both teams scored heavily. A DNF is no good to anyone & at this stage of the season, they don't have to be scoring maximum, especially when one of their main rivals (Ferrari) are having a bad day.

[theelanman]

well the german that used to do this retired so Im guessing Vettel is just stepping up to the plate to keep it going.....

[maz_r]

What gets me is all the "well, they are racing drivers, so it's in their blood to race" comments.

F1 is a team sport and whilst the drivers get the spotlight, they'd be nowhere without everyone else in the team. I'd like to see how many races they would win with without a car!

Redbull should make Vettel give the race to Webber next time that makes sense to do so, just to make a point. He's a fabulous driver, but there are 10 other drivers who could be just as fast given the same car.

Can you tell, I was underwhelmed by his arrogance.....

[theelanman]

I liked it when you drive for who ever you wanted for as long as you wanted...

I reckon itd be fun if they all did one race in each car....thatd shu the whingers up....and put a smile on the face of the back markers...
itd also mean that it wasnt the driver/team combo who generally won the titles and races.....

ah well....its never going to happen but itd be nice to think they do something.......

anyone else find these new purpose built tracks as exciting as having your teeth pulled.....

[chipp]

Seems a bit early in the season for team orders anything can happen between now and November.

Not really. If the Red Bulls had raced to the flag, they may have both overcooked their tyres & spun off. Webber could have earned the team all 43 points.
Similar goes for Mercedes. If Brawn had let them race or Rosberg had ignored orders, he could have caused them both to run out of fuel. They were telling Hamilton well before his final stint that he had to conserve fuel.

Both teams scored heavily. A DNF is no good to anyone & at this stage of the season, they don't have to be scoring maximum, especially when one of their main rivals (Ferrari) are having a bad day.

I agree with you entirely.
But both teams could have still finished with the same points all be it with respective drivers in a different position.

chipp

[DeanG]

I'm still confused as to why there were no significant penalties for the actions in the pits. Rolling through the wrong pits, releasing into another car, wheels almost coming off. The FIA is as bad as the local police, only ticking speeding and ignoring everything else.

[theelanman]

lol

[Rambo]

Vettel looks like a clone of Schumacher !!

PS Who remembers a few years ago when Monty disobeyed LEC team orders and overtook in the convoy going from the Travelodge to Donington. Maybe Vettel is Monty's love child

[Monty]

It`s way to early for team orders, infact i think they should ban team orders again. Vettel did the right thing, Mark Webber seems a good guy but he`s no Champ! Can you imagine Ayrton Senna not racing to win?

BTW the Beebs coverage has gone crapo


Still a good race

[rip]

It`s way to early for team orders, infact i think they should ban team orders again. Vettel did the right thing, Mark Webber seems a good guy but he`s no Champ! Can you imagine Ayrton Senna not racing to win?

I remember Senna running out of fuel in 2 consecutive races & none of the teams fuel to go flat-out for the whole race. If they raced until the flag, who knows if they would have both run out of fuel? Only their team.
Vettel & Webber have taken each other out before, so have Button & Hamilton when they were team-mates. This is exactly the type of situation that the team orders were trying to guard against.

As for banning team orders, they tried it. Then Ferrari gave it a middle finger salute by telling Massa 'Fernando is faster than you - do you understand'. Remember that one?
This was a blatant team code for 'move over or else' but how can you prove it was a direct order? FIA decided that they can't ban something they cannot police so allowed team orders again.

[Steve A]

It all boils down to Vettel cheating Webber out of the win they all agreed on before the race started (whoever is leading after the last pit stop), it really is that simple

[Rambo]

Is it just me, or does anyone else find F1 incredibly boring this year ????? I find that I am increasingly tuning in to watch MOTO GP. Much more exciting

[Enright]

It had the potential to be interesting, but when Vettel keeps arrogantly winning (with that damn finger!) it gets a bit samey.
Gary Anderson said something about there being too many people round the car during pit stops, which I thought was a really good point.
I'd like to see the fuel tanks made smaller too, in order to force the teams to make their engines more efficient.
I guess when we haven't even got a contender with a chance of winning it gets boring - I even found myself hoping Borat, sorry Alonso, would get a shuffle on yesterday so that "the brat" didn't have it all his own way.

[Rob P]

It is true that Vettel has made the whole thing a bit of a prosession recently but then if he's head and shoulders above everyone else and in the best car on the grid then every credit to him for making the best use of it.
down the field there were some interesting battles going on and it was nice to see the Sauber team in the points with both drivers this weekend.

I think the drivers movement from team to team is maybe nore exciting than the on track stuff, maybe Vettel could win the title in INdia and then let Danny Ricciardo take his seat in the Red Bull and he take the Torro Roso out for the last few races and see how good he really is

[Rusty Wishbone]

I have to say that Vettel & Red Bull have done such a very good job this year. It is a shame to blame a boring year on him, though. We have to blame Pirelli, McLaren, Ferrari and the others for doing such a bad job. I think that, if Pirelli had kept supplying the tyres from the beginning of the season, the racing would have been closer. Switching to last year's tyres played into Red Bull's hands and ended Ferrari's challenge.

Still we have had a long series of classic seasons, so a bad one was bound to appear sooner or later.

[DeanG]

To me the depressing part is that my two favorite F1 drivers will be at Ferrari next year.

A mid season Kimi quote that he liked Lotus better would make the season bearable if Lotus does OK.