A Pillar Seals

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A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Wed 22.01.2020, 19:47

Is there an easy way to remove the A pillar seals, ie without completely destroying them? I'm about to start to try to recreate some of Jamie's full windscreen seals and need to know if there is anyway back. I'm guessing it's a one way journey, but you never know?!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby dapinky » Wed 22.01.2020, 19:57

You'd be VERY lucky to get them out without any damage - the problem isn't in getting them out 'whole' - that is just a matter of extreme patience....

.... the issue is that the seals are constructed from an 'open cell' foam - so the only waterproofing properties come from keeping the outer surface intact. Once that covering is breached, water will simply soak into the 'sponge' - and have nowhere to escape, leaving it sodden.

Getting the seals out without even nicking the skin is the hard bit (and i'd suggest, if you are considering the modification, then yours are probably 'broken' anyway).

The seals are glued to the carriers with sikaflex, so unless they have been replaced previously, and NOT glued in, then you are a bit stuffed!
Dave

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go on - click this link - you know you want to!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Wed 22.01.2020, 23:56

Thanks Dave.I washed and treated the hood last weekend and had to put cloths in to protect the seats; both sides have had it, so anything I do is likely to be an improvement!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby Rambo » Thu 23.01.2020, 10:05

djwazza68 wrote:Is there an easy way to remove the A pillar seals, ie without completely destroying them? I'm about to start to try to recreate some of Jamie's full windscreen seals and need to know if there is anyway back. I'm guessing it's a one way journey, but you never know?!


No. You might be able to just about get them out in one piece but you won't be able to use them again successfully.

When Jamie removed mine most of the internal wire structure was well rusted. I kept them for a while thinking they might come in handy one day (as one does) but realised they were only fit for the bin. The rubber vs foam is far superior
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Thu 23.01.2020, 17:31

I've taken the plunge and removed the A-pillar seals, they were both fit for the bin prior to coming off the car anyway. As can be seen in the first photo.

IMG_0867.jpeg


I've also sorted out the Renault Megane A pillar seals that I took off a 2007 hard=top convertible, as can be seen in the next photos, so that they can fit the Elan. It was simply a matter of trimming the extraneous bits off with a Stanley knife and tidying up with a little bit of 120 and 240 grit wet and dry paper.

IMG_0859.jpeg
IMG_0860.jpeg
IMG_0862.jpeg

They slot directly into the carrier without any recourse to glue and even the mounting point neatly matches the Elan 'SpongeBob' excuses. With a couple of pieces from an old 916 GTV for the header rail and some Tiger Seal I think I should have a working solution for the header and A-pillar by the weekend.
IMG_0864.jpeg


The windows are already completely waterproof, once I get the header rail sorted I can start on the side sections!
IMG_0875.jpeg
IMG_0873.jpeg


More photos to come, but so far this has cost me the princely sum of £4 for the Alfa seals and £5 for the Renault ones; I had the Tiger Seal already! :cheers:
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Thu 23.01.2020, 19:08

I forgot to add the cross section for those who might be interested.

81406317-3830-4F57-BC94-F87DEC2D80FD.JPG
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Sat 25.01.2020, 20:14

So, I've not taken the plunge to remove the header seal just yet, but have nearly completed the A-pillars and effectively replaced the old sponge items with rubber bits. Taking the Alfa seals and trimming carefully I have created the 2 windscreen finisher pieces, which you can see in the following shots, with photo 4 being the completed finishers. The seal is good on both windows and header, the neatness is ideal and with some judicious use of Tiger seal I should be able to finish off the corners in a neat fashion (currently sitting clamped together with clingfilm between the seal and the hood).

Hopefully it's all clear in the photos, but I won't know if it is properly glued until tomorrow. If not I will Locktite the 2 parts and just Tiger seal to provide a neater finish.

Perhaps my biggest snag now is sorting the closure of the hood, the rear locking bars are too loose on the drivers side and too tight on the passenger side and so don't lock; what can I do to sort it out? There doesn't seem much adjustment in the hood?
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby PJR-Elan » Sat 25.01.2020, 20:45

I must say these look great and I am going to follow your instructions as soon as I can assemble the bits and pieces.

My A seals are rubbish and I’m convinced that updating them and the header will cure 90% of my issues. I once had an MGB with a floppy old hood around the windows, but the A seal and header worked well and it kept the water out despite big gaps around the windows.

Thanks for taking the time to post these pictures and info - I really appreciate it.

Phil
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Mon 27.01.2020, 22:37

Just had a look at my Tigerseal finish on the A post finishers and it looks pretty good. I may give it a very quick sand to dull it slightly but is actually quite neat as it is. Most importantly it is completely waterproof and seals well against the old header seal.

Just all the side pieces to replace now!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby Bern » Wed 29.01.2020, 13:04

This is all looking very good, you are giving me the confidence to do mine!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby PJR-Elan » Wed 29.01.2020, 19:25

I’ve tried to find some Renault seals, but haven’t found any yet. I don’t suppose you know the Renault part numbers by any chance?

V keen to try this :D
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby muley » Wed 29.01.2020, 19:46

:bowdown:

Well done. A very neat job.
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Sat 01.02.2020, 13:55

Final sanding and I think I will leave it alone now.

Moving on to rusty rear suspension now that water stops should stop leaking into the cabin!
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Mon 03.02.2020, 23:58

I don't know the part number I'm afraid; but try your local breakers yard. The 2006-2009 Megane hard top convertible is an ideal breaker these days, as they are cheap to buy and can be super expensive to repair.

I will post some daylight pictures of the seals once I get the car back together and outside. I'm keen to see what tidying up I can do with the seals once I can see them in good light. The flash on the camera makes them look untidier than they sre in real life.
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby muley » Tue 04.02.2020, 19:51

It's a bit ironic; if you Google up Mégane CC ~ there's a plethora of complaints about.. ..leaks ;)

Still a good find, though


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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby Jamie N » Sat 08.02.2020, 21:11

Hi DJWazza, Great to see someone taking the initiative and getting stuck in. ;-)

My worry though with these seals is when you do the hose test on them they might not be as good, or if they do manage to seal the A section you might find even more water ingress at the falling pillar seals, the reason being the Megane seals are not the usual EPDM that most manufacturers use, they are made from a harder type of rubber and much less forgiving than closed cell EPDM, therefore the positioning of them is super critical because too far out and they wont compress enough and will keep the door glass held further out than it needs to be to contact your other seals,too far in and you wont have enough pressure to make a waterproof contact.

I have a pair of these in the garage and there are always a few in the big yard, plentiful as you say, but personally i deemed them as little if any use on the Elan, far too hard for the Elan and a fair bit wider than needed, combined with windows that are not too rigid even at the best of times then it's always going to be tougher than it needs to be, even fitted to the Megane they have a bad reputation for leaks, from my knowledge of seals i would put that down to the rigidity of the material used in their construction.

Good luck though, if you can make them aesthetically better than the originals and pass the hose test you've done a better job with them than I could. :wink:
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Re: A Pillar Seals

Postby djwazza68 » Sun 09.02.2020, 19:47

Thanks Jamie,

All your points noted and I agree the possible problems, the ease of removal will mean I can replace them quickly if needed, I will only be £5 out of pocket. An adjustment on the driver's window might well be required anyway as the new side seals that I'm creating are going to be more slim-line than the originals.

I'm also about to replace both door seals with 2 new FTO seals; any tips gladly received.

Dave
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