S2 Exhaust - is this right?

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S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulous » Sun 16.09.2012, 21:08

Hi,

I picked up my new Elan yesterday and spent the day driving it quite enthusiastically! As a result I managed to blow the exhuast. However upon further inspection I'm slightly confused as to whether the centre section on my car is a correct S2 centre section and I'd like some advice before ordering a replacement part. My car is a UK 1994 S2 (no.285) with both cats still fitted. I've looked at centre section photos on SJ's but my car appears to have an extra section about 30-40cm long and it's this section that has blown. I'm wondering if a previous owner has fitted a non cat model centre pipe and added this extra section (assuming the non cat front pipe is longer than the cat front pipe if that makes sense). Can any UK S2 owners advise me here please? Take a look at the photo below, it's the short section that's blown, in fact you can see the hole...

Image

This short section look a bit of a mess! It almost looks home-made :-(

I'd like to know if a standard S2 centre section will fit before I order one.

Also will I be able to pick one up easily from my local kwikfit or will I need to use someone like SJ's ?

Thanks,

Paul
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby MPx » Sun 16.09.2012, 22:24

Chances are that after a while reading threads on here you'll be doing a couple of minor upgrades. The order should be Brakes, Exhaust, Chip. You seem to have an ideal excuse to do the exhaust first. I've stuck a Piper 2.25" with Sports cat and Pre Cat Eliminator. Its great but others have gone both more extreme and more conservative. Lots of threads if you search. I suggest putting the cost of the centre section into a new system and get a greater benefit than just no hole. :wink:
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby pearman00 » Sun 16.09.2012, 22:58

:agree:
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby dapinky » Mon 17.09.2012, 09:19

:agree: but I'll add a bit to answer your original question ('cos i'm more helpful than Mike :lol: :lol: :lol: )

The bit in your photo looks a bit home made / bodged up to me - it certainly shouldn't be there.

That said, i would imagine that at some point the car may have been grounded and either that section was damaged, or the whole lot was pushed back from the flexi pipe and that bit bent/split.

Nothing to worry about in itself, as it appears that the owner just cut out a section of knackered straight pipe and replaced it with another section......

....as to why it has gone in the same place i can only hypothesize/guess.....

....my best guess, going from the photos only, is that the section was repaired using a second-hand / scrap piece of pipe which was already past its best, but happened to be the right size and available. This is based on the photo showing that the rear clamp appears to be newer than the front clamp, so the repair was done on a budget (I would always fit new ones, 'cos old ones are a pain to tighten up properly if the threads are rusted, or the clamp isn't straight)....

...as to what to do about it - my advice would be to do another 'temporary' repair in the same manner as you currently have (or get a local exhaust centre to do it for you) and before spending out on anything exotic, get used to the car and ensure that evreything else is as right as you expect it to be.

Once you are happy, then consider a new exhaust - there are plenty of options, but the current recognised upgrades are from Peco (Cybox) or Piper.

I personally love the Piper ones, and being 'modular' can be tailored to whatever you want/need, wheras the Cybox are a complete unit of compatible parts with no options.

Bear in mind that Piper have just developed a new downpipe which matches the whole system, so if i were in the market for a new system for an S2 which will be used mainly on the road, with a bit of spirited driving, I'd go for a 2 1/4" system with the new downpipe and a sportscat.
You would probably be quite happy with just the main system and sportscat, and leave the pre-cat in situ - but i would consider removing this obstruction as they have been known to break up internally and cause later issues - although a good idea in theory, they have a very limited effect on emmisions, and the car should be good to pass the UK MOT without it, and some seem okay without any cats fitted.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulsmithmk » Mon 17.09.2012, 09:51

I think I have a standard system on my S2 but on a drive back yesterday lost all turbo boost. This may be the cat breaking up as has been suggested - there was a rattle from the exhasut before and same thing happened to me on a Merc before. I am wondering if for now I can remove cat inners (I did this on the merc) and then if this resolves the issue get a new system. Love sound of Piper but will also look at Vortex as they are a customer of mine... will kepp forum posted on this but any suggesytions on removal of cat at all?

Thanks

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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby rip » Mon 17.09.2012, 11:46

I have heard of others bashing the cat out. I have also heard of someone driving the car until it gets blasted out of the exhaust!
When looking at a replacement system, a flexi joint is helpful. Lotus never included this so the front section took some stress & the exhaust had a tendency to rattle against the bottom of the gearbox. They later added a bracket which simply moved the stress point further back along the system.
The Piper systems include a flexi joint for this reason (because when they designed it they asked us for suggestions & this was one). I believe the Peco system may have a flexi joint too...but the Peco is not offered with a cat so may not be suitable for S2s.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby HJ2 » Mon 17.09.2012, 12:11

I can confirm that.
The PECO (now Cybox) has a flex end as well.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulsmithmk » Mon 17.09.2012, 12:54

Vortex can do a system also. I am going to go and see them anyway so will see what things look like...
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulous » Mon 17.09.2012, 19:57

Thanks for all the feedback. I thought it was a bodge job! Having only become an Elan owner on Saturday my intention all along was to run the car for at least 6 months and really get to know it before spending any money on it. Obviously thats a tad optimistic and maybe even niave given that i didn't even make it to 6 hours before breaking something! So I think I'll go with Dave's advice and get some sort of temporary fix sorted and then look at buying a decent system next year. Along with brakes, roof seals and a chip....need to start savng my pennies!

Having read the exhaust forum in detail i really like the sound of the Piper 2.25 system. What I'd really want is something that unleashes a little more power, sounds similar to standard (nothing too loud and OTT) and passes an MOT without any hassle. So I think a piper with sport cat would do very nicely...or would I be likely to have MOT problems? And I presume the new downpipe they've developed does away with the pre cat too? And also therefore the PCE option isn't relevant?
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby GeoffSmith » Mon 17.09.2012, 20:00

If your car was registered before 1/8/95, then you don't need a cat but it might make passing the MoT easier!
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby MPx » Mon 17.09.2012, 20:21

paulous wrote:Having read the exhaust forum in detail i really like the sound of the Piper 2.25 system. What I'd really want is something that unleashes a little more power, sounds similar to standard (nothing too loud and OTT) and passes an MOT without any hassle. So I think a piper with sport cat would do very nicely...or would I be likely to have MOT problems? And I presume the new downpipe they've developed does away with the pre cat too? And also therefore the PCE option isn't relevant?


It seems our cars are all different when it comes to emissions. Some have no whiff of a cat anywhere and sail through their MOTs without issue - IIRC Geoff may be one of them, Ray another? I have a Sports cat but no pre-cat and it gets nowhere near passing which requires a right faff by SWLC for me when it comes to MOT time. Otherwise it meets your criteria very well...and I'd thoroughly recommend it.

Oh and you'll have read that you need to port the wastegate to about 20mm to stop overboost if you put a bigger than the std 2" exhaust on... enjoy!
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulsmithmk » Mon 17.09.2012, 21:26

attempted to take mine off this eve to see if cat is blocked - think it is a longer job than I intended - took me ages to try and get her high enough to get under - cue for a diet maybe?!!

job to be restarted at the weekend!!
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby Gazza » Sat 01.12.2012, 22:19

I have a Haywood & Scott custom made 2.5" with only the pre-cat in place.

I've not ported the wastegate or ever had overboost or a problem passing MOT
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby PiperRS » Wed 19.12.2012, 13:18

Hello Paulous!

If you are considering a new exhaust remember that the system can be fitted to your stock downpipe (solving the blowing exhaust issue) and our newly developed downpipe can be fitted at a later date replacing the entire exhaust with a Piper Stainless steel exhaust! :)

Please get in touch when you are ready to make an order and we can discuss prices etc (special deals for Forum members!)
Kind Regards

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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulous » Wed 19.12.2012, 20:58

Hi Tom,

Thanks, I'll definitely be in touch. I managed a temporary bodge solution for now , however its definitely a short term solution. My mot and service are due in Feb so my plan is to get a new exhaust fitted at the same time. I'm thinking the piper 2. 25 system but I'm torn between 3 options.... 1. Leave my old precat and standard downpipe in place, 2. pce replacement with existing downpipe or 3. New downpipe. Cost is a big factor, plus I'm not sure the downpipe is really worth the extra spend.

Comments? I want to unleash a little more power so happy to replace pre cat with pce and cat with sportcat, just not sure I'd actually notice £200's worth of difference if I go new downpipe instead.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby ccb056 » Thu 20.12.2012, 08:06

Paulous

might want to take a look at this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=21702

Upgrading the exhaust and downpipe will move more HP to the wheels, but you will have to port the wastegate. It looks like some people are still getting boost creep after porting the wastegate with the piper downpipe.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby rip » Thu 20.12.2012, 10:17

paulous wrote:I'm not sure the downpipe is really worth the extra spend.

Comments? I want to unleash a little more power so happy to replace pre cat with pce and cat with sportcat, just not sure I'd actually notice £200's worth of difference if I go new downpipe instead.


I don't have the downpipe...yet but what what I have read & understand about fluid flow, this are my comments:

The closer you are to the engine, the more important it is to have a nice, smooth exhaust flow. This is because fluid flow is very complex & you will have turbulence close to the exhaust manifold. All you can do is reduce this as much as possible.
A yard or two further on & the exhaust flow will have become a little more uniform.
Changing just the exhaust (from downpipe back) will not replace the worst restriction in the system.
I've not seen a detailed review of the downpipe on here from someone who is currently using it & I've not been in an Elan with one fitted either....not yet anyway :-D

I'm holding off from replacing my downpipe because I don't have very good facilities for taking off the turbo etc (because I will need to port my wastegate at the same time). Mine is also working nicely at the moment & I'm a bit reluctant to fiddle with it.
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby HJ2 » Thu 20.12.2012, 10:35

Missed this then? :o

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=21482
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Re: S2 Exhaust - is this right?

Postby paulous » Thu 20.12.2012, 19:42

Thanks for the info. Very interesting. Wastegate porting for me would mean spending yet more £££ as I'd have to find a garage capable of doing it for me (no chance if me being able to do it myself)

rip, what exhaust setup do you currently have?
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