Lower Seats????

[Elanlover]

I recall with my first Elan that "people" (whoever they were according to the dealership) had lowered the seats a bit for personal preference, etc. Has anyone done this? If so, how was the outcome, is it relatively straight forward and how did you do it? I've looked over some tech documents and it seems the rear spacers were larger than the front spacers. Did anyone plan for that? Thanks!

[muley]

I recall with my first Elan that "people" (whoever they were according to the dealership) had lowered the seats a bit for personal preference, etc. Has anyone done this? If so, how was the outcome, is it relatively straight forward and how did you do it? I've looked over some tech documents and it seems the rear spacers were larger than the front spacers. Did anyone plan for that? Thanks!

I know some people (the taller ones) have removed the rear spacers without any ill effects.

Jim b

[Sy V]

Yep I've done it - no problem.

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

I recently had to go that route. At 6 feet 4 inches tall and with the physique of a Chianti bottle, I need to do something about the seats. Basically you have two options. First, you can drop the seats by removing all of the four spacers (note that the rear outboard spacer is slightly taller than the rest).

Be sure to get shorter bolts. This is not optional.

For the underside hardware use only zinc plated nuts and washers or, better yet, stainless steel. Fit fresh nylon collared lock nuts.

For the holes that go into the frame, run a thread restorer/thread chaser to make sure all of the threads are straight and true. A dab of anti-seize on the threads won't hurt either if you live anywhere near a rust belt region.

For the rear outboard seat mounts I stacked up a few flat washers to compensate for the thickness difference between that spacer and the others. In retrospect, I don't this step was necessary.

Second, you can remove just the rear spacers and leave the fronts in place. If you are tall with long legs, you may need to do this in order to get a more comfortable angle onto the pedals. I am probably going to have to do this in a few weeks. I'm still putting some miles on with the seat all the way down.

A variation of the above is to take the two taller spacers and put them on the driver's side front mounts to get as much angle as possible on the seat bottom. I may be trying this as well.

Also, as incongruous as this may sound, I have discovered that tipping the seat back slightly forward has resulted in a more comfortable driving position.

Don't forget the driver's seat has a wire lead for the seat belt indicator light. Also, if you take out the seats, use that opportunity to thoroughly condition them, clean the cockpit and replace the rear speakers (if they are trashed like mine were).

If you should have any other questions, please do not hesitate to ask.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Hi Algirdas and thanks for the detailed reply. I'm only 5' 10" but I find that my eyes level out more to the top of the windshield than in the middle. Also, the steering wheel is a bit low to the knees for my tastes. I've got the seat back just about as far as it will go with the back at a firly generic (not geriatric) angle.

I'm thinking that taking the spacers out might help this. Whadya think???? If so, do you happen to know the bolt specs that I'd need to go get to replce the existing, longer ones???? Thanks!

[Elanlover]

The bolt sizes I now have (just looked them up in the parts guide). So, I'm assuming its as simple as taking the stock bolt length and subtracting the spacer size to get the desired replacement bolt size. However, the guide diagram makes it look far less simple than that.

From what I see, it looks like the front spacers are identical and that the inboard front bolt runs through the floor to the outside bottom of the car where it attches to a nut on the outside. The outboard bolt doesn't seem to run through the floor though. Also, it looks like there's only one spacer at the rear of the seat (is that possible?) on one side. I'm thinking that's just the diagram though and that spacer is for both sides.

If you've had the seats out could you confirm for me that the above is/is not the case? Thanks!

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

My recollection is that there are spacers in all four corners with the outboard rear on each seat being taller than the others.

My recollection is that the two inboard bolts go into the frame while the two outboard ones go through the car's floor and use a relatively large washer to help spread the load.

I'll be out in the garage this weekend and will get you the bolt lengths etc. if you can wait until sometime over the weekend. If you need the information for this weekend, let me know and I'll try to get it for you tonight. Be sure to use zinc plated or stainless steel fasteners. A drop of oil helps the bolts go into the frame for those of us outside rust zones. I would probably err on the side of caution up in TO and use a small dollop of anti-seize compound.

I hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Algirdas, I'm happy to wait until the weekend or whenever you get the chance to have a look. Don't rush out with a micrometer just for me I appreciate the help.

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

I have not forgotten. Just busy with other stuff. I'll be in the garage most of the weekend (July 4th) and will get you those dimensions on the bolts.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Thanks Algirdas, I'm not planing until getting at this issue until the weekend at the earliest so no worries. I appreciate the assist.

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

Here are the bolt sizes I am using with my lowered seats:

Outboard front and rear: 10mm X 1.50 (std. thread) X 40mm in length. Actually I am using 50mm length bolts since that is what I had laying around the garage and these are the bolts that go throught he floor and have nuts on them.

Inboard front and rear: 10mm X 1.50 (std. thread) X 35mm in length.

I have them out on the driver's side (LHD) and can re-check them if necessary.

Please note-I am using NO SPACERS anywhere. My seats are sitting flat on the car floor.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Thanks Algirdas, I'll probably take a look at this on the weekend. I think I'll throw in some washers at the back to maintain the original angle (somewhat) of the seat as I like it. Don't know if you noticed a difference without any spacers at all as the rear spacers are higher than the fronts by 5mm (I think) - no spacers means a slightly different angle than stock. I suppose the fromt of the seat would feel a bit higher.

I take it you used stainless and if I do the same I'll probably have to order them. Do you think a plated bolt last (they are easier to come by)? I'm guessing you re-used the washers as well. Any issues removing the bolts and seats at all?

Lastly, according to the parts manual the bolts for the seats are:

Front Inner: M10x40
Front Outer: M10x45
Both Rear: M10x50

The spacers are supposed to be 25mm (front), 25mm (rear inboard) and 29mm (rear outboard) as far as I can recall so i would have simply deducted the spacer depth from the stock bolt length to arrive at:

Front Inner: M10x15
Front Outer: M10x20
Rear Inboard: M10x20
Rear Outboard: M10x25 (plus 4mm of washers to maintain stock height)

These seem to be much smaller than what you've used (unless my math is wrong). Any issues with the length you've used (i.e. sticking out of the bottom of the car more than you'd like?). Think these lengths would do the job?

Thanks again!

p.s. I'm not much for bolt sizes, etc. but I'm guessing that an M10 is the same as a 10mm bolt.

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

Originally that is how I computed the new bolt lengths, but what I posted is what worked for me. The inboard ones are the ones that require the most attention since they screw into the frame (appears to be a captive nut setup). The outboard ones bolt through the floor so mine are a bit longish since I had some 50mm bolts laying around. I'll be going to the hardware store today during lunch and may pickup a few bolts and try those lengths tonight.

I spent a bunch of time trying to shim up with washers the driver's side outboard seat, but I'm really not sure it was worth the effort. My backside is not that anal to notice the difference. The seat glides work just fine without the washers as spacers.

If you can get stainless rather painlessly, then go with the stainless. If not, then you should be more than ok with a zinc treated bolt. I live in a semi-arid region so rust is a fairly distant concern. But in TO, that is a different story (I grew up in Chicago and made many a road trip in my youngers days to your fair city.). You guys know how to brew beer!

A little bit of lubricant makes getting those bolts in and out go much more easily.

Please let me know if there is anything else I can do to help you.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Thanks Algirdas, I can get stainless, its just that they have to order them in - go figure. I may go with zinc plated since they're not likely to be seen anyway so don't need to look pretty.

As for the beer..............did you know its all free in Toronto now? City by-law was passed just after your last visit.

[algirdas]

Dear Elanlover:

Nice try, but you are going to have to get up awfully early in the morning to pull a fast one on me, my good man. Everyone knows that municipalities enact ordinances and not by-laws.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

[Elanlover]

Dear Elanlover:

Nice try, but you are going to have to get up awfully early in the morning to pull a fast one on me, my good man. Everyone knows that municipalities enact ordinances and not by-laws.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

Ahhhh...............not in Canada eh.

http://www.library.yorku.ca/ccm/ScottRe ... bylaws.htm

By the way, Trixie at the Brass Rail sends her regards