Lotus Elan Central

by **ESM** » Fri 03.02.2006, 08:47

Brian - the ideal is a fast rise to and a steady hold at the target boost. In practice improving one tends to mess up the other. The boost often overshoots into overboost territory in my car but teh ECU it winds it back just in time to stop fuel cut (overboost has occur for a defined time before cut). I've messed with a couple of things relating to the rate of rise, the frequency at which the bsv duty is modified has been increased, the increase/decrease steps reduced (because they are executing more often). I also increased the time to set the overboost error code and turned off overboost fuel cut (just for the testing though).

by **F1 LOTUS** » Fri 03.02.2006, 18:41

I guess that improving flow through the wastegate (porting) would help with the over-shoot and control sensitivity then

Sy, if ESM was truly into teasing he'd mention his rear brake discove...oops :oops:

sorry guv.

by **ESM** » Fri 03.02.2006, 21:24

Porting wouldn't help in this instance because the rate of rise after the passive boost limit has been passed is controlled by the rate at which the ECU increases the 'leak' in the pressure line to the wastegute capsule. The faster the increase in the duty cycle the sooner the boost target is achieved, however, if the increases to the duty cycle is done in big jumps then you'll generally overshoot the target. If you add in the fact that the turbo efficiency rises very rapidly over the mid rev range, overshoot can be very bad if you're not careful.

Ah my rear brake discovery... Don't tell anyone...

I looked through my back wheels and there I beheld brakes and I was glad

Then they seized up and my anger was as a storm with thunder and lightning and everything.

Weeeellll, at least a gale anyway

ok, ok my anger was as a day with a bit of light drizzle and stiff breeze

by **Elanlover** » Tue 07.02.2006, 20:39

ESM, I've a question about the performance of your chips if you don't mind me asking. I've seen some charts posted here that show horsepower with and without the chip. Unless I'm mistaken, there seemed to be a point, just below 4K rpm I think, where the hp actually dropped below stock before rising up again.

Why is that? And, can that be addressed at all? The hp increase looks great but if that little blip could be smoothed out do you think it would raise performance even further? Overall HP wouldn't change obviously but smoother delivery of it would produce a better effect.

Or am I all wet here................ :shock:

by **John_W** » Tue 07.02.2006, 22:16

Elanlover wrote:... there seemed to be a point, just below 4K rpm I think, where the hp actually dropped below stock before rising up again....

Power and torque look OK to me. (If you're comparing them with your own figures, remember that mine were taken with a 2-1/4" squishless exhaust fitted, so dyno power is already up on standard even before fitting the everest).

Remember that the boost doesn't kick in until about 3000 RPM, so ESM's done a good job to smooth it out already. :bowdown:

Not that it can't be tweaked I'm sure. :smt064

John

by **Elanlover** » Wed 08.02.2006, 15:08

John, I've seen something different than your chart and I can't remember exactly where (other than it was posted in the forum somewhere). I think it may have been an ElanScan chart but again, I can't recall exactly. The chart seemed to show a point in the power curve where there was a significant drop-off then an immediate rise again. I'll go fishing and see if I can find it.

by **Elanlover** » Wed 08.02.2006, 15:37

Ok, i think I've found the graphs to which I was referring. Right in this post of course :roll:

Even better, it appears to be your chart John :shock:

http://www.awsnet.co.uk/lec/images/john_w_power.jpg

Now, I could have sworn there was another graph somewhere in the forum but I could be completely wrong here. Hey, I could be completely wrong about this graph too :lol:

But, I had just thought there was a power "hole" in the curve somewhere. Am I completely wrong ????

by **John_W** » Wed 08.02.2006, 22:03

Elanlover wrote:Ok, i think I've found the graphs to which I was referring. Right in this post of course Even better, it appears to be your chart John

http://www.awsnet.co.uk/lec/images/john_w_power.jpg

Now, I could have sworn there was another graph somewhere in the forum but I could be completely wrong here. Hey, I could be completely wrong about this graph too But, I had just thought there was a power "hole" in the curve somewhere. Am I completely wrong ????

Elanlover,
the graph you refer to was posted as an illustration to my post on page 1 of this thread (17 Aug 2004 22:44): the second picture "power vs RPM for standard and Kilimanjaro" which now appears as just a red cross on my screen. The "power hole" you refer to is where I changed from 2nd to 3rd during an acceleration run.

The graph should really be interpreted along with the other graph from that post and the ones preceding it. In fact I wouldn't bother refering to that particular series of graphs any more, as they were presented very early on in the development of the Mountain chips. Their purpose was to discuss why my installation wasn't seeing as much of a power increase as expected; the short answer is that the static timing required setting correctly.

While you're looking through old graphs, there's another dodgy one lurking about somewhere which looks like this. It's wrong because of an error at low RPM in the dyno used for the early Mountain chip evaluations (ie the blue and yellow lines should not be so high below 4500 rpm; all dyno run results after January 2005 are OK).

John

by **Elanlover** » Thu 09.02.2006, 00:00

John_W wrote: The "power hole" you refer to is where I changed from 2nd to 3rd during an acceleration run.

Changing gears.......umhhh......................... :bonk:

Closing mouth now. Thanks for the clarification. (I'm thinking ESM has been watching from the sidelines all the time holding back from replying until newbie gets trained)

by **John_W** » Sun 12.02.2006, 21:36

Come to Donington... all will be explained.
:wink:

John

by **Elanlover** » Mon 13.02.2006, 19:28

Would be a bit of a drive for me.........need some pontoons too. I'l be there in spirit though :smt023

by **taffy** » Thu 23.03.2006, 13:21

Hi
Alan installedan Everest chip in my SE at Donington. Very impressive performance increase, however the tickover starts initially at about 1300 and drops to 1000. It does not drop below 1000. Has anybody got any ideas as to what the cause may be. And more importantly how to cure.
Thanks
Nigel
On another note nice to put a few faces to names at Donington, pitty it was not a LOT warmer and I may have been tempted to spend more time outside looking at the other Elans. Next time perhaps.

by **pjohn151** » Thu 23.03.2006, 14:11

To set the base idle, you should put the engine in co adjustment mode (ie engine running and paperclip connected to ALDL terminal so that check engine light is flashing). Once fully warm (cooling fans cycled on/off) the screw on top of the throttle body can be adjusted to get idle to 950rpm. Remove paperclip and everything should be OK.

Phil

by **John_W** » Thu 23.03.2006, 16:09

Taffy,

but first check that the CO potentiometer is correctly trimmed (instructions are around somewhere). If it is not correct, the idle is likely to be lumpy and uneven, rather than just too high. If OK, then do as pjohn151 advises.

John

by **pjohn151** » Thu 23.03.2006, 16:41

Oops, of course, if it is a new chip in the ECU, then you will need to get the CO checked first as John_W says...

Again, CO adjustment should be carried out using the same methodology as the idle adjustment I mentioned earlier - engine in 'co adjustment mode', and be checked at 950rpm. Adjustment is made through the variable resistor mounted near the ECU - blue plastic thing with brass screw head showing.

Phil

by **Elanlover** » Thu 23.03.2006, 18:48

Can anyone advise whether a bypass valve is advisable/useful if the chip is installed? Any positive or negative impact? Thanks!

by **taffy** » Thu 23.03.2006, 21:24

O.K. Lets get somthing straight.
You assume I am stupid and you will not be far wrong! What and where is the ALDL.
The last time I put a paper clip in something it set an alarm off!
There must be somthing somewhere on an ALDL string but I can not find it.
I like pictures, have you got any it is easier than reading.
Thanks for your advice
I have also been reading on the dump valve, from what I have read by placing the valve it can reduce the load on the bearings in the turbo. Sounds logical to me. Also from what I understand the turbo would remain spinning and hence reduce any lag after gear changes. This may be a complete load of ------- but it may also be correct.

by **pjohn151** » Thu 23.03.2006, 22:29

The ALDL connector: This is inside the car in the passenger footwell. It's usually clipped onto a bracket on the front bulkhead at just about the passenger's toes height (UK car). You may find it easier to open the glovebox and ease it past the stop so that it swings down (emptying the contents of said glovebox in footwell). A drawing exists on ESM's website - it is the lead hanging down in that...
http://www.astb91.dsl.pipex.com/ECU_pos_rhd.jpg

The paperclip needs to be unravelled and made into a U shape. The ends of the paperclip are then inserted into terminals A & B of the socket (the one with White/Black & Black coloured wires leading to them). The engine (if running) will now be in CO adjustment mode, or if engine off, engine chek light will flash any error codes.

Hope this helps

Phil

by **taffy** » Fri 24.03.2006, 08:41

Thanks Phil and everyone who has given assistance.
I know what I will be doing this weekend. Where can I buy a paper clip straightener?

by **John_W** » Fri 24.03.2006, 09:18

taffy wrote:Where can I buy a paper clip straightener?

http://www.toolsbypost.com/product.php? ... tegory=308
John

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