Two New Tyres - front or rear

[Gary]

I need 2 new tyres and can't hold off any longer (warning on the MOT). Should I put the new ones on the front or on the rear ?

[Enright]

Rear.
Understeer is controllable by lifting off, but oversteer is a killer in FWD cars and lifting off (the instinctive reaction) only makes it worse, so always put the best tyres at the back.

[Gazza]

[Gary]

Ok cheers. Back it is then

[RayD]

Not meant for the experts...

When mixing tyres on a precarious handling car it’s a good idea to aim for the max recommended pressures to be the same on all 4 wheels.

The max pressure is an indication of the wall stiffness - it keeps the car handling the way it was intended.

Before you reach the dramatic understeer or oversteer the tyres tends to ‘walk’ across the road during cornering – one band of tread lands slightly nearer the outside kerb than it did on the previous revolution...and so on.

Ray

[JIMBO]

I need 2 new tyres and can't hold off any longer (warning on the MOT). Should I put the new ones on the front or on the rear ?

Rear is the right position. If you fit new tyres to the front you will get tread squirm which will lead to understeer and longer, less controlled braking.
Regards
Jim

[tweetdriver63]

This whole thread is confusing me. Maybe I'm just an idiot.

If putting new tires on the front will do bad things, cause understeed, etc, then won't that also be true if you put on four new tires??? So....a new set of tires will make the car handle worse???

Front tires wear faster than rears on front-drive vehicles, so I've always heard that the front is the place for the new ones when you only replace two.

Again, maybe I'm just an idiot.

[Enright]

Note I said "always put the BEST tyres at the back".

So when you wear the fronts out, you put the old rears on the front, and the new tyres on the rear.

The topic is only about the best choice when putting 2 new tyres on.

[RayD]

Does anybody know where the idea came from?

It seems to be one of those things that gets round on its own.

Ray

[Rambo]

Interesting point this - the current thinking is to put the new tyres on the rear of a front wheel drive car.

I'm old enough to remember the good old days 30+ years ago when the words of advice from garages were front wheel drive - new tyres on the front and rear wheel drive - new tyres on the rear.

So my questions are:-

1) What's changed this thought process ? Or is it simply the reasons described above ?

2) So, with a rear wheel drive car, would you put new tyres on the front ? And for what reasons ?

[Gazza]

I always swap them over because if you don't you end up with very old tyres on that back with 2 or 3mm of tread, while you have had 4 sets of new ones on the front.

Gazza

[RayD]

Mark,

I don’t think anything has changed.

What gets me is how it came to be “common knowledge.”

You wouldn’t think people would get enough experience with different permutations of tyre wear on a Lotus Élan to know one way or the other.


Ray

[dapinky]

It is only on this forum that i have ever come accross the 'Best tyres on the rear' comment.

Now, that's NOT to say that it isn't published elsewhere, or that it is wrong, or that i disagree, there appear to be sound reasons for it.

What i would say is that (like Rambo), I'm old enough to remember that the driven wheels always get the NEW tyres ('cos they wear fastest), and the wheels on the steering axle get the 'BEST' tyres (for grip).

BUT.....

This is wisdom from the age of the Morris Marina, Vauxhall Viva, et al (and probably well before then) which all had RWD and low power outputs.

4WD was restricted to LandRovers and nowt on the road had it, Tyre technology has also moved on in leaps and bounds........

Enough of the past, I follow this with interest, but in the meantime, i don't go fast enough on the limit to worry about it, and the tyres are all 'Good' ones which stick to the floor.

One question though, when does a 'Good' tyre lose its 'Goodness' ????

It is widely accepted that a tyre is past its best at 10 years of age - so although Michelin were original fitment, even if they have plenty of tread, are they as good as a newer tyre of lower initial quality?

I ask because I've recently put a pair of Yoko 008's on the front, whilst retaining Michelin on the rear (of unknown age, and i cant be bothered to go and get the date code off them at the moment!).

Now, I've always liked 008's (The tyre of choice for motorsport back in my day!), but accept that although i purchased them as 'unused' they cant really be called 'new'. i trust the seller, and know that they have been stored correctly, so am happy to put 8 year old tyres on my car - if i can find another pair, I'll snap 'em up, but in the meantime, the Michelin on the rear *MAY* be better than the Yoko's, or may not

So what do i buy when the Michelin need replacement???

And which end do i fit 'em ('Cos if you think I'm prepared to have 008's on the back with Budget on the front, you're having a laff!)


(realistically, i think the choices are currently down to Yoko, Toyo and NCT5 - with perhaps Avons/Kumho as a thought).

[M100 TWO]

the second posting on this subject by Neil says it all, but like Gazza I swap them over so they wear down at the same rate
diff

[Rambo]

One question though, when does a 'Good' tyre lose its 'Goodness' ????

It is widely accepted that a tyre is past its best at 10 years of age - so although Michelin were original fitment, even if they have plenty of tread, are they as good as a newer tyre of lower initial quality?

Recently I have seen an immaculate SE with it's original Michelin MXX2 tyres in excellent condition - well they looked good with good depth and no sidewall rubber perishing - but who knows ? I saw a similar situation at Donny a couple of years ago on a car being sold by Paul Matty - maybe the same Collapso red SE ??

I guess if the car/tyres have been stored correctly and out of direct sunlight and direct heat they may still be good ? But I can't help thinking that these tyres will be about 17 years old

Personally, I put on the best tyres I can afford and steer clear of "budget" tyres, especially for a performance car. Over the years these have included the excellent Goodyear Eagle F1's and more recently Michelin's and Yoko A539's (maybe a good tyre for you Dave when your Michelins are burnt out ?)

In answer to your initial question Gary - stick 'em on the rear - but forget about buying those KwikShit remoulds that you saw for £24 a corner

[ailwyn]

I'm no expert but my logic goes like this:

Never push tyres until they've got at least 500 miles on them, this should remove any of the coating from the new tread, always put the thicker tread on the drive wheels, if you do end up locking the wheels, the thicker the tread the better, also a thicker tread should mean less chance of aqua-planing if you do have to brake hard in the wet.

I have no idea whether this is the right way to do it, but it's served me well for the last 14 years.

As for the swapping front to back, if your doing it based on economics then it's a false economy, but I can accept it if it's done part way through the wear, say when the fronts are down to 3mm and the rears are still at 5-6mm, but only to fit with the philosophy above.

[RayD]

There should be a separate word to distinguish ‘understeer’ from ‘careering off the road head first’, likewise for ‘oversteer’ and ‘going backwards into a field’.

All cornering cars understeer and oversteer to some degree. When they’re both happening to the same extent there’s usually a Lotus badge on the boot lid.

Tyres with a taller tread on the back wheels will oversteer more, rather than less.

Under normal circumstances, I don’t think anyone would notice which end they were on, but I’d put the new ones on the front.

Ray

[DeeAitch]

Bought two tyres for Mrs DeeAitch last year and the tyre fitter, receptionist et al insisted they should go on the rear.
Being from the old school when the best tyre went on the axle most likely to wear them out quickest (Rear tyres on old Minis would last for years) I said bollecks and had them put on the front
Seems to me that the theory is safety driven. They want the best tyres on the Rear as most mere mortals have no control over that end, should it start to slide, especially if due to lift of oversteer in the wet
For me they go on the front, providing the rears have plenty of tread and are of reputable make.

[RayD]

Well... at least we’ve found something we all agree on.

One on the back, and one on the front, it is then...

Actually I can think of a good reason for this idea, providing it’s the driver’s side.........

Ray

[Breed]

Hi

I am older than most of you and in days past new tyres were put on the driven wheels but this was before front wheel drive was popular ie cant think of one front wheel drive car when I first started driving. So read bit below and make up your own mind. I always put new on the rears regardless of F or RWD. Too important to just guess at.



Most drivers think that new tyres should be fitted to the front wheels...
A car tyre is often a distress purchase, but even when replacing one in the course of normal vehicle maintenance, it has long been believed that the new tyres should be fitted on the front wheels. Research by TyreSafe, Britain’s foremost tyre safety organisation, has indicated that over 50% of motorists believe this to be the case and 30% of motorists did not know.

However, recent demonstrations have indicated that it is more beneficial to fit the new rubber to the rear wheels, regardless of whether the vehicle is front or rear wheel drive. Industry research suggests that if the new tyres are fitted to the rear wheels, water on the road surface is better dispersed, which improves straight line braking ability. Conversely, if the rear track is fitted with part worn tyres, the car often has a dangerous tendency to oversteer.

As the majority of the cars on the road are front wheel drive, it seems to make sense to have the new tyres up front. The demonstrations also showed that there is often a greater loss of control when a rear tyre suffers a puncture, so in fact it makes greater sense to fit the fresh, less vulnerable rubber to the rear wheels.

Rear tyres are subject to relatively low wear rates as well, meaning that the new tyres will have a longer lifespan on the back rims. Fitting new tyres to the rear and moving part worn rubber to the front each time also means that the rear tyres will be less prone to age-related deterioration from prolonged exposure.

For further information please contact Chris Wakley or Simon Wittenberg at TyreSafe, 21-25 St. Anne’s Court, London W1F 0BJ Tel: 020 7494 8050 mobile 07970 674612
Email: cwakley@automotivepr.com

Regards
Bill