Lotus Elan Central

by **Elanlover** » Thu 22.02.2007, 22:34

If I may be so bold, exactly what is the concern about issuing the V5 to people that requires a price increase???

by **ESM** » Thu 22.02.2007, 23:40

Because it pushes to the limit of safe operation and therefore I will offer it only where it can be switched out easily, switcher parts cost more than twice as much as the standard upgrade, because the time to construct banks of PROMS is greater, because the power increase it offers is slight over a cheap and cheerful single program chip but no-one will take a V4 if a V5 costs the same, because it'll still be much cheaper than a BBR or superchip but is way technically superior to either....

by **John_W** » Thu 22.02.2007, 23:54

Elanlover wrote:If I may be so bold, exactly what is the concern about issuing the V5 to people that requires a price increase???

Elanlover,
I think Alan alludes to some of the reasoning in this post.

Apart from the obvious extra hardware and development costs, I think it comes down to the fact that tuning any car involves removing some of the inefficiencies in the design. However some of those inefficiencies also act as margins for error.

A couple of examples in the case of the Elan are:
1) the exhaust "squish": remove it and you get a freer flowing exhaust and more horsepower. However you also risk boost creep.
2) the fuel map at high revs is very rich. If you increase the air:fuel ratio at higher revs you get some more power. However if your car is not properly set up (timing spot on, no air leaks in the turbo hoses, no MBC or BBR orifice fitted which you may not know about) then it is conceivable that the fueling may end up being too lean, which will kill your engine.

In other words, tuning in general should be done responsibly and with mechanical sympathy and understanding. The inefficiencies in design can act as failsafes / idiotproofing which might just have been put there by deliberate decision of the manufacturer, and if you tune to remove them you'd better understand what you're doing and the possible consequences.

I believe Alan has always erred well on the side of caution with his development to ensure things are totally numpty-proof (everything being extensively tested before release); maybe he's just getting near the limit of his comfort zone of making things idiot-proof. "Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot." :wink:

John
edited to say: I need to type faster or make shorter posts: I see Alan has already replied.

by **Elanlover** » Fri 23.02.2007, 02:30

Thanks Alan. I hadn't realized that you were planning to bundle it with a switcher only. I thought you were referring to the cost for a V5 chip only. If more components are involved then more cost is inevitable and that's no problem by me.

Although, I do like the "Monty Discount" concept :smt081

Not to worry, I'll gladly pay whatever you wish to charge. As long as you charge Monty double that is........

by **Russc** » Fri 23.02.2007, 10:41

Can understand totally where you are coming from, however if the gains from v4 to 5 are not that great you may well find that people go for the 4 to ensure engine safety.

Totally agree re price though, more work and more parts = more ££'s

by **nissias** » Fri 23.02.2007, 15:11

ESM wrote:I think only LEC people buy them anyway - no-one else knows about them!

Geoff - I was thinking along those lines

I would say double the price is very reasonable Alan.
You know I am willing to pay right away for one of those switchable ones with all the features
Let me know when you can have one available for me as I am leaving UK in 40 days

by **ESM** » Fri 23.02.2007, 19:26

Ok a new site is up, switchers are listed out of stock because I have only five and way more than that number of requests... I'll sort out who's top of the queue when I get back to base on Sunday. Anyone who's requested a V5 and would, after reading the blurb and considering the cost, prefer a V4 please let me know.

Nissias you might be in the top 5 anyway but if not I'll see if I can lurch you up the queue a bit.

I'll update the old site and link it to the new one on Sunday too.

by **Russc** » Fri 23.02.2007, 21:27

Brilliant website, answers all my questions.

I feel the advice given is also good, i`ll be going for a V4 and if i want more i can always go for the V5 at a later date (although i also like the idea of switching to a lower mode on the fly, eg snow/hard rain)

by **algirdas** » Fri 23.02.2007, 21:32

Dear Alan:

Please sign me up for the Full Monty-Cali Fed. I'm in no real big hurry. Fill the other orders first since they seem to be the most pressing.

Sincerely,

Algirdas

by **Sooty** » Fri 23.02.2007, 23:45

Alan,

I could live with a V4 if max power is similar to the V5. Let me know my position in the queue and I'll check the VIN no and let you know which one I need.

by **John_W** » Fri 23.02.2007, 23:48

ESM wrote:Ok a new site is up...

Alan,
Nice. ... You've been a busy boy.

Especially, the Elysium Mons looks like a nifty idea. The extra boost in the mid range should give you a nice bit extra oomph on the way through, while reverting to 0.9 at higher revs gets over the problem of our relatively small turbo being unable to sustain the boost for long. Neat solution.

I think that site just about covers all the questions which have been flying around.

Well done.

John :bowdown:

by **DeeAitch** » Fri 23.02.2007, 23:59

Superb new site Alan - Can't wait fot Olympus mons to get here :wink:

by **nissias** » Sat 24.02.2007, 00:23

ESM wrote:Ok a new site is up, switchers are listed out of stock because I have only five and way more than that number of requests... I'll sort out who's top of the queue when I get back to base on Sunday. Anyone who's requested a V5 and would, after reading the blurb and considering the cost, prefer a V4 please let me know.

Nissias you might be in the top 5 anyway but if not I'll see if I can lurch you up the queue a bit.

I'll update the old site and link it to the new one on Sunday too.

Thanks Alan!
You are the best and I am sure you know it!
Let me know about the cost and if you want me to pay with Paypal right away mate

Cheers!
Nik

by **nissias** » Sat 24.02.2007, 00:32

Alan.
What's the difference between
Switcher upgrade and V5 PROM 1499 & 9949
and
Switcher upgrade and V5 PROM 9929 & 9930

and then what about SST and AMD? I got a bit confused what I am getting.
Do I need to have anything else already on my car as to fit these new things on? I just have a V3 Everest chip as far as I know (and btw I do not use my electronic boost controller - it's always switched off! Waste of money).
My car is a 91 SE turbo

What am I buying then?

Do I have to buy a 9929 V4 and then the upgrades for the V5? Or do I have to buy a 9929 V4 + either SST or AMD + the switchable board?
Let me know so that I can get a better idea and sort your payment out

by **nissias** » Sat 24.02.2007, 00:48

as far as I understood by reading through the pages, I have to buy the Everest 9929 V4 chip + the Switcher upgrade and V5 PROM 9929 & 9930. Do I have to buy either the SST or AMD chip update? Please let me know Alan

by **ESM** » Sat 24.02.2007, 10:23

Nissias,

If you already have an Everest of any generation then all you need is the upgrade - which comes with a chip.

The chips on the upgrade section of the site are for people who want to upgrade from older chip versions to the latest version.

by **nissias** » Sat 24.02.2007, 13:57

So the V3 everest will do then. I only need the Switcher upgrade and V5 PROM 9929 & 9930. I just remember telling us that the price was going to be double (around 200GBP) and that's why I thought I had to buy at least two things which would add around that figure in the end. Quote me with the final price with delivery and where and how you want me to send the money at

How will we be able to change through programs? I know the switch should turn clockwise and anti-clockwise with clicks obviously but does the car have to be switched off before changing through a program? maybe on idle? or can you switch through programs while the car is moving?

by **John_W** » Sat 24.02.2007, 21:15

nissias wrote:How will we be able to change through programs? I know the switch should turn clockwise and anti-clockwise with clicks obviously but does the car have to be switched off before changing through a program? maybe on idle? or can you switch through programs while the car is moving?

Nissias,
You can change while the engine is running. But you shouldn't have to.
John

by **nissias** » Sat 24.02.2007, 21:35

not bad then

by **ESM** » Sun 25.02.2007, 18:55

Nissias,

The upgrade is £100 or so, if you were starting from scratch and had to buy the standard board too it would cost double but as an upgrade it costs the same as the original item.

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