Radiator - Gone again !

[dapinky]

The coolant level has been topped up a couple of times since Donington, but never by a lot.

When i got up yesterday (i'm on nights) Angie tells me that it had a bit of a leak when she parked it up outside.

'A bit of a leak' is like saying that Zimbabwe has a small problem with its inflation rates

After it had cooled down, it appeared to be coming from the nearside of the radiator - The hose was good, but there was water in the headlight well - it appeared to be coming from the bleed screw thingy.

I thought it might be a simple matter of it working loose and needing tightening up a bit - unfortunately when i turned it a bit, the top snapped off the threaded bit

By fishing it out with a screwdriver and pair of snipe-nosed pliers i set about sorting out a replacement - it's a standard M12 thread, so i found a suitable bolt and 'o' ring as a temporary measure.

The water level was to the top of the rad, so i fitted the new bleed screw and chucked a pint of water in the top tank to check the integrity of my new bolt.

That was when i noticed that there was air/water leaking from the join between the end tank and the core of the radiator - right at the top (hence the water level in the rad was up to the top).

A number of questions are raised.

The rad is only a year old, so shouldn't have gone again this quick unless there is some other problem.

I don't think its another HGF, as it was done at the same time as the radiator - but i suppose you never know.

Does anyone know if it is possible to tighten up the crimps which hold the end tanks on?
Can it be done in situ, or do i need to take it out?
Do i just get another one?
Is it worth a shot of Radweld?

[chris.t]

Does anyone know if it is possible to tighten up the crimps which hold the end tanks on? I don't think so cos this is the fault which causes you to have to change the rad in the first place

Can it be done in situ, or do i need to take it out? N/A

Do i just get another one? If there is nothing wrong with the rest of cooling system is there any chance you could claim 'not fit for use'?

Is it worth a shot of Radweld? of course you are joking!!!!

check it out for HGF and all other things that could cause over pressurisation, if you find nothing i think you have cause for complaint and compensation of some sort.

[GeoffSmith]

Even if the cooling system overpressurises, the header tank cap or the hoses (if the cap is u/s) are the weak points in the system. There is no way a one year old rad should come apart unless you didn't put any antifreeze in and you left it outside in a severe frost. I can't imagine you forgetting the antifreeze and it's been a warm Winter.

Therefore: No argument - duff rad, full refund.

[Dave Eds]

Agree with Smithy

Rad recored 4/5/07

Pinks - I will speak with Gerald at GST on Monday (would have tomorrow but I know he's away) and see what recourse we may have.

PM me if you have any more details that may help. You have PM

Edit - GST did not recore the rad directly - they had it done by a firm they use regularly. This was the 2nd one they have done for me. The first was done 20/5/06 and is on my d/d and has not been a problem (unlike some of the hoses, thermostat etc ). The 2nd one I had done specifically for Dave to put in Angie's car. Angie's old one then went to rip (as he apparently had some problems with his cooling system).

[Dico]

But don't they use the original end caps when they recore?..... and thats where its leaking from

[GeoffSmith]

...... rip (as he apparently had some problems with his cooling system).

Did he. I can't remember that.

[Dave Eds]

But don't they use the original end caps when they recore?.....

Yes, but only if they are "fit" for re-use. I think the problem is where the cap fits to the rest of the rad that may be the issue.

[Dave Eds]

...... rip (as he apparently had some problems with his cooling system).

Did he. I can't remember that.

I thought he'd mentioned it in passing

[Dico]

...... rip (as he apparently had some problems with his cooling system).

Did he. I can't remember that.

I thought he'd mentioned it in passing wind:roll:

CHOO CHOO

[Dave Eds]

...... rip (as he apparently had some problems with his cooling system).

Did he. I can't remember that.

I thought he'd mentioned it in passing

CHOO CHOO

Aye, eye

[Dico]

I thought he'd mentioned it whilst passing wind

[dapinky]

Just imagine my excitement when i logged back in and saw how many replies this thread had attracted.

I was looking forward to all those words of wisdom which would help me out....

....then i realised (that with the exception of the ever-helpful Spud) most of the rest were as a direct result of Dico quaffing the ale

Okay then as i'm stuck with an immovable motor (at the moment) with one of the wishbones still to be swapped, and the MOT booked for Tuesday, I think I'm a bit buggered for a while.

I think I'll try and splash some radweld in for now so that at least i can get it in for the MOT - booked for Tuesday (& therefore tax it at the end of the month!) as it is currently out on the road.

In relation to the rad itself, i can't be sure, but the plastic end tanks certainly looked as good as new, i just assumed they were new, but i suppose they could have been old ones?????

Either way, the leak seems to definately be from the top of the join where it hits the core - so i think its either a duff gasket or a duff crimp.

Dave, If there is course for complaint, so be it, but i don't hold you personally responsible even though you sold me an item which is 'not fit for purpose' under the Sale of Goods Act, and under the provisions of the Act, my complaint should be against my supplier (you), not the original supplier (don't feel guilty, mate!)

To answer other questions, there has always been a suitable antifreeze/corosion inhibiter in the system since the re-build. I went for the super red stuff with 5 year life (most of which will now end up in the gutter ).

I don't think there is a HG problem, as the system has not been over-pressurising, or bubbling - temp guage and heater have also been exactly as they should be. - unfortunately i can't do a sniffer test, 'cos there ain't nothing in the header tank!

[GeoffSmith]

OK it was red but was it EG, PG or OAT? Some late shift reading matter.

[Monty]

Dave,

1st thing to do is rule out a HG problem, sort out the bleed nipple and top up the coolant, take it for a run and then do the sniffer test. Don`t forget that you haven`t got the Lotus gasket fitted and you know what happened to me, so a check of the head bolts might be in order

Hopefully it`s just down to the Rad

[dapinky]

OK it was red but was it EG, PG or OAT? Some late shift reading matter.

I'm not at work, and having no trouble feeling sleepy so I'll give it a miss!

As stated in the correct thread - it's some red stuff with a 5 year life - made by carplan, other than that, i ain't got a clue!

[muley]

Does anyone know if it is possible to tighten up the crimps which hold the end tanks on?
Can it be done in situ, or do i need to take it out?
Do i just get another one?
Is it worth a shot of Radweld?

From a sober Jim ..

1. Possibly.
2. Probably not. Yes.
3. Yes.
4. Maybe

If it is a recore then there is prolly some sort of warranty with it - get it redone. The challenge will be that the gasket that sits between the end tank and the core has almost certainly failed, so I doubt that it can be fixed.

I have a spare rad - recored that has only done a few hundred miles (to Le Mans and back!) you can borrow, but Nige has it on loan at present.

HTH


Jim

p.s the info about the thread sizes was useful

[dapinky]

Okay, there may be the start of a plan here!

As a result of a selection of PM's and 'open' posts i have received a number of offers from many kind souls.

I have spoken to my legal advisor (No, i don't talk to myself - he is a civil/commercial lawyer) and he thinks there is a good claim against the reconditioners.

At the moment, i do not really want to try any sort of 'repair' to my rad, until the people who have done the work on it have been spoken to (Spud?). That way they cannot accuse me of taking their responsibility away.

If they want the original one back, i'll have to remove it and send it away, which will leave my car off the road, but so be it.

If that is the case, i might take up the offer from Jim (muley) to borrow his spare, if Nige isn't using it, or seek another one as a temp measure.

If they are prepared to re-con another one first, and then have mine back, then Andy (Hayworth) has offered his old one, which Gazza currently has as a pattern.

Or they may be happy for me to try a radweld temp repair and then send it off to them, but i won't know til sometime this week which way they want to play it.

If they try and wash their hands of all responsibility, i will need a longer-term solution whilst going through any legal process. lets hope that won't be necessary

I will have to accept that it isn't a deliberate or malicious act on their part, and i won't be seeking punitive damages (but would expect any costs to be covered - eg postage of units around the community, which i consider to be reasonable).

I'll have to cancel the MOT appointment for now, and see what happens, as i don't really want to send it in to a garage with a known fault which may get worse when they run it up under load for the test.

I have not been able to get enough water to stay in the system to allow a 'sniffer' test to be done, as it just pours out of the leaky bit when the engine starts to warm up at all - but i can say that there are no bubbles blowing into the header tank.

Monty, i checked the head bolts just before Donington, and they were fine, so I don't think that is a problem - as posted elsewhere i checked them after the head change, and again at 500 miles - all okay (its a regular check that i make, in the current HGF environment!)

[Monty]

I known that you rechecked after 500 mls but thought it was worth another recheck since it must be rare for a new/recored rad to let go:? saying that with the crap design of having plastic end caps they are the weak point.

If the rad is a year old then you`ll be lucky to get a replacement, but it`s worth a try. If i`d had the dosh i`d go for the Ally version that Gazza is having done.

[Dave Eds]

Pinky - you have another PM and email.

If anyone has Dave's no. can they PM it to me or text it to me please (but not by email 'cos I'm at work not home!).

Edit - thanks to whoever text me Dave's no . - we have now spoken.

[dapinky]

Well, the rain dried up for long enough for me to get under the car and whip the radiator out.

I have to say, I'm getting quite quick at it now - under half an hour had it sat on the road in front of the car. (Just one of the benefits of stainless fixings and cleaned threads when i did it last year).

I'm not sure if it's good news or bad news really

I've found out it isn't the gasket, but a crack has formed in the plastic end tank, running along the folded bit just by where the crimps hold the tank onto the core.

If you've ever taken out your rad, you'll know what i mean.

Therefore, i am fairly sure it is just down to mechanical failure/age, and not over-pressurisation.

This is the good news, as Gerald had got me worried that a duff header tank cap and HGF (again) could cause the gasket to blow, as it is the next weakest bit.

The bad news is I now have to sourse a new end tank. There have been various reports in other threads of a Peugeot(?) part..... Can anyone tell me more?

I'm going to pop into a radiator place up at Avonmouth tomorrow to see what they can do for me - I'm hoping that as the core is only a year old, it can be re-used with a different end tank - or even, if the end tank can be welded - hopefully they will know the options.










PS does anyone have a nice reliable Mazda Eunos which they want to swap for an Elan...........



.....after all, they look the same, so it must be a better option.





(only joking)