Samco hose Puzzle

[HJ2]

Hi all!

I am in the progress of fitting another samco set to one of my friends Elan.
All goes well, except for the big Y hose from rad to engine and el. pump. It just wont fit!
I have the clip on the fat pipe next to the PAS pump connected and the pipe to the El. pump and the headertank. Now i try to fit the fat pipe to the radiator bottom pipe... but it just won't fit!
It appears that the hose is too short. The engine did not move back, the radiator did not move forward, but the pipe just appears not long enough without over stretching the fat pipe

So, is there a difference in length for the 3 available kits for the fat pipe from engine top to rad. bottom?

All help appreciated as I am stuck, and i want the car out of my garage so my own car does not have to sleep outside with a parking ticket

[HJ2]

After a couple of frustrating hours... Took the pipe out and compared it to the old one.
It looks like the Samco is 3 cm short! Who would have guessed that?

[brijo]

Hi HJ2,

At the weekend I fitted a Samco silcone hose kit to my Elan. Everything went well until I got to the long hose from the bottom of the radiator up to the block at the fitting called the suction pipe. With the hose up to the shoulder on the suction pipe, the other end was only onto the radiator by maybe 20mm. The jubilee clip would have had to be fitted on top of the 3mm wide lip on the radiator fitting, the one which provides the seal. I measured the length of that section of pipe along the surface, following the bends, and compared it with the stock pipe I had taken off. I estimated the silicone hose to be 35mm short.

Just this morning I emailed Samco with an image showing the measuring tape along the Samco hose and another image showing the tape along the Lotus hose proving that there was some 35mm difference in length. I received a reply shorty after from the product manager stating that Samco had sold between 50 and 60 Elan kits since 2009 without an issue.

I wondered if anybody else on LEC had encountered this and I'm relieved to find that you also have had this problem. I am curious how you overcame this difficulty. I need to continue searching the forum to see if this has been a recurring problem or something new.

Brian

[HJ2]

I was asked to send a picture, same results as you describe (still got to send the picture though as i am very busy! ...)
So, You're not alone!

The first Samco set i did was on my own car (An S2) , and it fitted without any problems!

As a solution i would be happy to recieve a tube, a short (big diameter) pipe and 2 jubilee clips to lengthen the short Samco one.

However, it now looks like the design could do an update and leave the big hose 5 cm longer, to cut lentht correct in situ.
I will mail Samco this week, as they are a respectable company i'm sure they come up with a solution for all LEC members.

Regards
Henk-Jan

[brijo]

Thanks Henk-Jan,

I will get back to Samco now, knowing that somebody else has had problems in that area. I'll let you know the outcome.

Regards
Brian

[ccb056]

I replaced the hoses with rubber ones from Dave Bean. The bottom radiator rubber hose to the engine is also too short and needs a pipe with a short extension hose.

[Brit-Car-Nut]

The FED car is inches longer than the others as well as mounting the radiator differently, thus needing different hoses and different plumbing.

[HJ2]

Interesting and true, but this one is European

[brijo]

Henk-Jan

PM for you, when you get a chance.

Brian

[epipete]

Chaps, so where does this leave those of us who need/want to replace our old worn hoses with nice efficient new ones? If we order the Samco's then are we in for a nasty surprise and a confrontation? If not Samco then whom can provide?

Can you confirm if the Samco kit includes the Hoses (Elan Parts Guide 18:05 items 4 & 5) supplying the Heater Matrix, ie those from the heater valve to the heater and the return pipe?

Cheers

Pete

[ashm]

I also fitted a SAMCO kit to my Elan and noticed that this pipe was significantly shorter than the original. It was just about long enough to be fitted, but with absolutely nothing to spare. I remember thinking they'd really pushed the limit with that one...
Adam

[brijo]

Hi Pete,

As requested by Samco I returned the short hose (TB1838) to them for examination. It was received by Samco on 31st July. It seems producing a slightly longer hose isn’t that simple because the hose is made only slightly oversize and also, the tooling is setup to cut the hose at a predetermined length.

I believe it was Samco’s intention to purchase a new Lotus original hose to compare. Samco is baffled why between 50 and 60 kits had been sold between 2009 and now, without issue. I was relieved to discover that someone else (Henk-Jan) also had this problem.

I had been on holiday for 2 weeks in August and when I returned I emailed Samco to check on progress, but the guy I had been dealing with was on leave. He’s due back today and I’m waiting for a reply from him. I’ll give him until tomorrow to catch up with his emails before I email him again. I would like this sorted soon.

Apart from the issue over the short hose I am well pleased with the silicone hose kit. Expensive, but they feel and look good. If you’re thinking of buying a kit hold fire for a little while until this is resolved. It would be useful if Samco were to know that other potential buyers were hesitating because of this problem.

And, yes, the kit includes the 2 hoses to the heater matrix.

Brian

[brijo]

Hi Adam,

I wasn't aware you had contributed until my post was gone.

You have obviously made the hose fit, and I could have too. But I thought it was uncomfortably short and took the issue up with Samco.

I'll send you this guy's name and email address in a PM and would appreciate if you drop him an email so that he's aware that there are probably many more users out there who thought the hose was short but just made it fit.

Brian

[epipete]

Brilliant Brian,

Thanks for that, I'll hold fire on this order 'till we hear more.

Pete

[Neill1607]

I'd been looking at buying a kit, but have held off after reading this thread - am happy to be quoted as such!

[brijo]

A glimmer of hope. I have offered to send my old Lotus rubber hose to my man at Samco so that he can compare and realise that the Samco hose is at least 20mm shorter than the stock hose. If convinced, he said that he would alter the tooling to increase the length of the silicone hose.

He'll be out of the office tomorrow morning until next Wednesday and promises to give it priority when he gets back. Watch this space.

He also said that he now has a set of original Lotus turbo hoses on his desk. He hasn't actually said so but I get the impression Samco could be making silicone turbo hoses in the near future. The correct length I hope.

Brian

[ashm]

He also said that he now has a set of original Lotus turbo hoses on his desk. He hasn't actually said so but I get the impression Samco could be making silicone turbo hoses in the near future.

[norman lovie]

looking at the parts document, you can see the different lengths of this 32mm ID swan neck between the pump and the radiator - for the x 2 versions shown pictorial and there is two versions of the one piece versus the two piece hose depending if its a SIR or none SIR car
i.e x 3 versions identified - room for a bit of confusion there

[norman lovie]

just received my kit ( 95yr S2 version )
there is maybe 10 to 15mm difference in the overall length of the pump to rad. hose section - not able to trial fit at the moment, but I can see how it might fit or maybe just be a tad on the short side
can appreciate they may not desire to go re make moulds
maybe if they offer a short spacer pipe with a short hose extension, with the option to cut back the hose to make room for the spacer if you find it a bit tight

[Lotus54]

The right side hose ony federal Samco kit has the incorrect bend.

I emailed them, but never got a response.
I put some more clamps on it to keep the shape, otherwise it want to pinch.