Better Front Spoiler Grilles

[Jeemy]

I'm starting this topic to get a bit of feedback and interest in replacing the front grilles.

Queries I want to address:

- how to remove the bloody things
- if a different mesh might affect performance with air getting to the radiators
- how to proceed to a group buy

I had intended just to blast off and use existing diamond mesh which I've used on my van grilles to great effect. Its soft enough to mould by hand, and you can mount lights easily in it for those of you interested in merc-style DLRs.

Example here:

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I am right at the point I can take these out and make templates. I'd intended to take them out, use them to mould existing diamond mesh and make replacements, then refit the (already squint) towbar surround to it.

BUT there is no way I can see of removing them without using extreme brute force; enough to perhaps damage the (already squint) fibreglass.

As my fibreglass and surround are both already squint and my radiator is out, I can work on this in the background while i finish the engine.

So just want to know as mentioned above:

1) anybody got a clever way to remove these? The manual states it is Betaseal adhesive, a polyurethane. Anything that would loosen its hold would eat the fibreglass from my meagre chemical knowledge

2) what the performance issues of using a diamond mesh would be? my guess is the stuff I have actually presents just as much surface area as the chicken wire, maybe 10-15% more at best. is there any limiting factor to airflow?

3) finally, does anybody else want to replace these grilles? I virtually can't bring myself to progress when they are so unaesthetic. i've considered just putting cosmetic panels over the front; again, the answer to two might suggest whether this was a reasonable option. if enough people want to do it we can speak to Lockwood or another manufacturer or put together do-it-yourself kits.

[epipete]

For consistency, are you intending to do the rear bumper trim the same?

[Jeemy]

MIne is already the same. Well, its a smaller diamond, but I thought everybody's was like this? I assumed the bigger grille at the front to be for airflow reasons....

[wayne]

Looking at my spare bumper they seem to be held on using a combination of betaseal and fibreglass.
Even with the bumper removed I'd be surprised if you can get them off without damage.

[Brit-Car-Nut]

The Federal grilles are a little bit different as we don't have a tow eye or any cut-outs in the center grille.

I made new ones from stainless .5" mesh That I had powdercoated in semi-gloss black after forming. I used a length of 2"x6" lumber and cut it to match the grille outlines by creating a pattern using the bumper openings and a sheet of cardboard. The stainless folded fairly easily but I still screwed a pressing plate to keep it flat across the opening area. I will add pictures when I get back home tomorrow. The stainless was a bit heavier mesh but not enough to reduce air flow.

I found a company that was willing to cut the bulk stainless material to the proper width in a 48" length and then ship it rather than a 3' x 4' sheet. They used heavy, thick cardboard so the screening didn't get bent.

The grilles in my yellow car were held in with a urethane sealant (Beta-Seal) like the other body panels, not a silicone type like silkaflex. I got some primerless windscreen installation urethane from the local glass house.

I used the same stuff to reinstall the rear grille but had to make a styrofoam insert to keep the oval consistant.

Removing the original grilles was easy using a windscreen removal knife. cleanup is easy using standard single edged razor blades. No chemicals were required. Since I knew I was replacing the front grilles, I cut the mesh just above the attaching sealant so I could cut it out from both sides.

[Rob P]

I'm sure one of the Guys I met up with for the drive to Donington had different mesh on his Elan, it looked like Stainless steel mesh, Tim (AKA Whippit) was his name so hopefully he might be able to add to this thread when he pops online

It was on a Red Elan and looked really neat

[JohnB]

I replaced mine with aluminium diamond mesh. Easy to bend and I used the left and right originals as a pattern. I left the centre one in place on the car and put the new mesh in front of it. I secured the new mesh with a glue gun.
I haven't had any problems with overheating and the temp gauge reads the same as it did before.
Please ignore the rubber spoiler, I've got a new one ready to go on.

[cliff]

Looking at the new one I have here, there are also 5 screw tabs so I guess there are screws somewhere under the silkaflex or whatever was used.

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[Jeemy]

@JohnB - how did you get it off?

@Cliff - I will poke at those spots on Monday, see if I can find screwheads

[whippit]

Rob p was right about me changing mine , did mine the same as john B , aluminium diamond mesh, easy to work and cut , not really tarnished in three years,

as for removal of original mesh on mine that's a 91 its only fixed with beta seal , no screws or fibreglass, all i used was a sharp stanley blade and a bit of water to lube the blade so the beta seal did'nt grab the blade , i managed to remove them without any damage

as for performance ive had no overheating issues at all , i got stuck in walking pace traffic for 45 mins on the way home from Donington, the ambient temp was warm , the fans never cycled so must be ok

[Rob P]

Rob p was right about me changing mine , did mine the same as john B , aluminium diamond mesh, easy to work and cut , not really tarnished in three years,

as for removal of original mesh on mine that's a 91 its only fixed with beta seal , no screws or fibreglass, all i used was a sharp stanley blade and a bit of water to lube the blade so the beta seal did'nt grab the blade , i managed to remove them without any damage

as for performance ive had no overheating issues at all , i got stuck in walking pace traffic for 45 mins on the way home from Donington, the ambient temp was warm , the fans never cycled so must be ok

Tim, how was the new Aluminium mesh fixed to the Bumper please as I fancy sprucing up mine

[Jeemy]

Had a quick look about.

Betaseal is hard to get it seems apart from evilbay, where it can be bought for £9.68 for 1, or £15.51 for two, plus £12.95 postage. This is from the US. It says its windscreen adhesive.

I'll speak to a mate who does windscreens, see if he has any tips for dissolving it, look for those screws and see if I have them, and try again with a fresh Stanley blade.

The other option is Tiger adhesive which is a PU too I think and used for sticking on bumpers, spoilers, trim etc; or good old Sikaflex.

Obviously the area for application has to be clean so its worth cleaning *before* removing the old seal; using a toothbrush and tardis, surfex or similar; this way once its removed leaving presumably a clean surface thats been sealed since first application, you don't go spreading dirt over it if you clean up.

Once this is done I'd planned to wrap the old one in fabric or thin card to prevent scratching and smooth out the shape a bit, so it was basically a template then bend & cut the new piece by hand over the top of it. The old pieces could then be sent away for making templates long-termly.

Cliff's appears to be edged. I can try and look into this edging which must be some kind of C-section. I'd not planned to edge, just to fit in place & use Tiger, except around the tow bar where I'd planned to prise off the old one.

I'll contact the windscreen guy and also the Betaseal salesmen in the US and see if we can get a discount rate per box of 12.

[cliff]

Don't think it's edging, more of a support frame to fasten the mesh on to.

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It seems a very complicated (and expensive) way of doing it.

Wrapping it around from the rear & sealing seems to be the way to go. I like John's solution as well, fixing from the front will be much easier especially as I don't really want to take the rad & condenser out again.

[JohnB]

@JohnB - how did you get it off?

@Cliff - I will poke at those spots on Monday, see if I can find screwheads

I had the wheel arch liners off at the time and I can't remember exactly how I got them out, but I don't remember it being difficult to remove the left and right grilles. As I said, I left the centre one in place and put the new mesh in front of it. I bought one of those tiny Rolson electric glue guns and glued them in place through the round holes underneath at either side.

[Jeemy]

I've only tried the centre. Perhaps the left & right ones are much easier to remove. The surrounds will be much sturdier. Will try to get under the car on Monday and evaluate.

[Jeemy]

I've finalised this and its actually way easier to clip the mesh out leaving 1cm protruding perpendicular to the bumper, all round. Then make your grille from cheapo diamond mesh off eBay, finagle it in, fold the protruding pieces back round and then rub Sikalex on it with a gloved hand! There will be pictures on my thread. The bother I had getting the intercooler off, I was certainly not going to try to get the oil cooler off and access from the back at the side pieces is fairly useless. Combining the centre piece with a new radiator and fans is a good use of time. Pictures on my thread shortly, I will try to link here.

[Jeemy]

So yes, pictures here. Not that they are in any way helpful in showing the process, but it is fairly simple. Sikaflex is £5.50 from Screwfix and the diamond mesh is about £10 from eBay. So with a pair of wire cutters, 10-20 disposable gloves, its a sub-1-hour job doing it the front way.

Spray-painting oil cooler or charge cooler at your own risk.

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