I want to change the PAS fluid

[Motocompo]

Hi,

I want to change my power steering fluid. I saw the video of Elan M100 Restauration and he explains it very well.

What I didn´t get is if on a LHD vehicle is everything the same? Or is the pump on the left side of the car?

Also which components to I have to remove to get access to the pipes in order to drain the fluid?

Any help is welcome, thanks.

[Tuga2112]

the reservoir is the same place regardless of which side the steering wheel is.
I Would advice against the full drain approach. draining the reservoird, refilling with new and running the engine 3 times will give you all the benefits of a complete drain without any of the pain of accessing the PAS and reservoir and the mess of spillage etc .

as far as reservoir location
as open the bonnet look at the far left corner, theres 2 reservoirs there,
the one harder to access (in white) attached to the bulkhead is the brake fluid.
the one further to the front in black is the PAS reservoir.

if you follow the tubing from the PAS reservoir you will find the pump is on the front of the car, right next to the light pod motor. with a rather large pulley

[chrism]

A bit confused by "running the engine 3 times"...

3 starts + stops - or 3 'uses' of the car? Presumably to mix loadsa fresh fluid into the depleted old stuff?

Thanks for the advice, I was fearful of doing a full drain but I think the fluid's really, really old; possibly original.

I can see the wisdom of syringing out the old and replacing with fresh (presumably it'll be mixed in after 'running the engine 3 times'?

[FunElan]

My method, which seems to be working, is to use a turkey baster and remove the fluid from the reservoir, then refill back to the level the fluid was at. I've done this a few weekends in a row and the whining sounds I get when the car is warmed up has reduced significantly.

[par]

A bit confused by "running the engine 3 times"...

3 starts + stops - or 3 'uses' of the car? Presumably to mix loadsa fresh fluid into the depleted old stuff?

Thanks for the advice, I was fearful of doing a full drain but I think the fluid's really, really old; possibly original.

I can see the wisdom of syringing out the old and replacing with fresh (presumably it'll be mixed in after 'running the engine 3 times'?

My interpretation is that with the engine running, rotate the steering from lock to lock 3 times, that should mix the added fluid with the remaining original.

HTH

[chrism]

Ah, I geddit FunElan - repeated dilutions rather than total replacement.

And par, that steering rotation interpretation makes sense too.

I think getting (say) a litre of fluid and combing both ideas sounds like it'll be a significant and timely refresh for my 'old girl's' steering rack.

Thanks for the inspiration folks

[Tuga2112]

I Assumed the M100 series mentioned the turkey baster "shortcut" approach. But ive just watched the first minute and it was only refering to the full procedure (gives me content for another video)
after talking to people and seeing everyone being aware of the Turkey baster trick, Ive just assumed anyone would know

what i originally meant by "run the engine" was "drive around the block and make sure you do a 3 point turn" (those always force you to both turn the steering rack lock to lock as well as bringing the RPMs higher than iddle, which helps mixing the fluids faster. )

repeat process 3 times, and the old fluid will be practically gone from the system by diluting it with new fluid.

Its the same principle that keeps Mick Jagger on stage jumping like a 20 year old..

[Motocompo]

No, it is important that the engine is NOT running. Please watch the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5ezLJEDjps

[chrism]

Motocompo, I think I can understand that reasoning if the steering cycling is done with no fluid in the reservoir. In that case air would be drawn through the pump, but if you replace the fluid in the reservoir leaving just enough at the bottom 'to fill the pipes' then surely the newly-replaced fluid will be drawn down to mix-in and refresh the original fluid, especially when the steering is 'Mick Jaggered' by Tuga's three cycles?

I'm thinking the onus might be with the removal of enough of the old fluid from the reservoir so as not to introduce any air (?) and if it's done a further 2 or 3 times to use up all the new fluid then more of the old fluid might be replaced.

Just a thought...

[Tuga2112]

the principle is to mix the old fluid with the new fluid, by doing it enoguh times, you will effectively replace all the old fluid without the need of a spanner.

use turkey baster to remove as much fluid from reservoir, fill up reservoir with new fluid, go for a drive, or turn the wheels lock to lock with the engine running in the driveway (if you dont enjoy driving the elan)
repeat process.
every time you do that, you are making the solution in the whole system a lot "newer"/"younger" (therefore my reference to Mick Jagger)
under the assumption that the reservoir volume is the same volume that the piping and rack uses, thats 50% reduction on the fluid's "age".

im merely suggesting al alternative to get new fluid in, without the whole hassle. truth is, steering issues with the Elan are usually not related to the fluid, But this is the approach i was told to follow many years ago just to start somewhere easy.
ultimately my issue was an MOT inspector trying to make money off the fact the elan steering is stiff from factory (ive been told to avoid torque steer)

Years later I had stiff steering again... which after another run of new PAS fluid was further diagnosed to the U Joint at the bottom of the steering column .

If you want to do the full process, im sure the workshop manual will have further information. (tab in the up of the page links to a download there if you are logged in)

I dont know if you want to do a complete flush for peace of mind, or if its because you want to diagnose an issue, or if its just as preventative maintenance. I cannot offer any advice on the "proper" procedure because i simply never had the need to go that far in order to keep my car on the road.

I Hope that clarified, I understand explainign over messages in a forum is a bit odd and the feedback cicle is at best hours instead of seconds as you would have in a chat context.

[chrism]

Yep, makes sense to me, so this morning I got a litre of NAPPA DIII from the local motor factor.

The old fluid was a rusty brown colour compared with the crimson colour of the new and the reservoir had been over-filled (to the 'top' mark when cold)

I emptied the p/s tank with a syringe and refilled with new. I didn't really bother with Tuga's Mick Jagger moves cos I reckon normal usage will circulate the new stuff. In any case normal swinging out into the road will suffice and anyway I intend to keep repeating the syringe stuff, weekly or so, 'till the fluid is used up - I expect 3/4 more times.

So...I avoided the 'messy' way I reckon

Edit: Later in the afternoon I put a couple of ice-cream tub tops between the garage floor and the front wheels to make it easier to turn the steering and swung it left then right, full lock, six times with the engine running. Less lively than a MIck Jagger move but a bit of a compromise, I thought, to start the fluid mixing.

[Motocompo]

OK today I changed the fluid.

For LHD the power rack assembly is on the left side, so remove the left wheel to get access to the nuts.

It is very difficult to reach the nuts. I had to cut off a 14 and a 16 mm wrench. There is a rod right in the way which makes the whole procedure quite difficult.

Also the nuts can be very tight. This can be a big problem.

Maybe to empty the reservoir with a turkey baster as many here recommended is the better way to do it.

[chrism]

Yes, as d-i-yers we need to try to solve these difficulties and report back so others can make an informed decision with stuff like this.

Your initial pain means that you have a baseline of fresh fluid that'll be now easy to keep fresh by few subsequent 'turkey basterings' but it'll be longer and more involved for me to reach your status via many more 'turkey basterings' since I'll have to clear out the old fluid gradually by repeated dilution. I suppose like an inclined plane or stairway; it's an equivalent result whether by fewer steeper steps or many more smaller steps.

Avoiding those tight and rusty nuts, no jacking and no wheel removal might serve to swing my decision - but 'well done' that you succeeded, and grateful that you reported back outlining the difficulties

[Tuga2112]

glad you both got it sorted. guess thats another note for my list of FAQs

[chrism]

Just to update: My litre of p/steering fluid 'did' 4 complete exp tank replacements with a little left over for a 'skimpy' 5th.

For the first few I did 'Tuga's Mick moves' then drove it as usual but for the last few I just did the few usual journeys then changed it, since it didn't seem to need the 'three-pointers' to mix in. (I'm wondering if this might be a left-over from the full-system drain process to purge any air bubbles?)

I'm now happy that the fluid has been 'replenished' since it's substantially back to it's crimson colouring - so thanks to all who've suggested the 'baster' process as an alternative to the more involved (imo) complete drain + refill.

[Motocompo]

If you decide to completely drain the fluid like in the video this tool might be useful:

Werkzeug.jpg

I don´t know what it´s called but it´s much more slim as an usual wrench so it fits right around the nut and you have no problem with the other nut that is located very close. Also it has more "grip" like an ordenary wrench which might help to undo the tight nuts.

[Tuga2112]

If you decide to completely drain the fluid like in the video this tool might be useful:

Werkzeug.jpg

I don´t know what it´s called but it´s much more slim as an usual wrench so it fits right around the nut and you have no problem with the other nut that is located very close. Also it has more "grip" like an ordenary wrench which might help to undo the tight nuts.

theres a similar tool called a crows foot. but i never seen one that is a cut off a 12point spanner. all crows foot ive ever seen for sale were cut outs of 6 point spanners