Error Codes 22 + 33, High Idle and Running Rich

[roj]

Update time.

* Throttle body cleaned and the corroded pipe replaced.
* New IAC valve purchased (Lucas FDB953). Rotated 180 degrees and modified to fit.
* New TPS Throttle sensor (from China) fitted.
* A reminder that all vacuum pipes have been replaced. Ones that I can see / reach.

All parts have been fitted and point to note that the battery has been disconnected for the past week so I should imagine the the ECU has reset. Connected ElanScan and checked out the TPS. Nothing! Checked continuity on my connection leads that I had soldered on to the new sensor and all checked out. Tried again.No joy. Stuck connection cable on to old sensor and refitted. Sensor showing movement with voltage and position readings.

Started the car and running high (4000rpm).Took it for a gentle run to get the IAC valve to reset. Light throttle driving just over 30mph. 2 minutes into journey and bit of hesitation from the engine and the engine light came on. Seemed to run fine for remainder of journey apart from high idle. Logged the drive (or so I thought) with ElanScan.

Returned home, paper clip test revealed error code 22. Checked the data on ElanScan which I could see. Saved it out to a file. Since trying to open it again, there appears to be no data. FFS!

Went for another drive, no engine lights came on. However, car is driving itself because of the high idle. 4th gear and I can take my foot of the throttle pedal and it’ll continue along at 30mph.

To top things off, Elan Scan is now not playing ball and isn’t talking to the car.

Currently feeling down and disappointed. Really thought cleaning the throttle up and replacement of parts would sort things out. New to this old car stuff. My Exige goes to the Lotus dealership and I just hand over the cash.

At a loss as to what to do next.

[KenS]

Hi Rog, if you are still open to peoples thoughts on this - have you verified the base timing? I think it may be around 9 deg rather than 16deg from the original Elanscans for startup in the first post ?

timing.JPG

Hard to be sure since the timing needs to be set/viewed while in service mode (with the paperclip inserted into the ALDL plug). The procedure also needs to set the IAC position, details are in the WikiLEC section https://wikilec.com/view/Base_Timing .

Another thought, there is a vacuum port on the back of the Plenum that is only used on S2 cars but should be capped on SE cars with a rubber cap, without it you would have a vacuum leak, worth checking that the cap is in place and not perished. From the manuals it looks like the plug and the piped connection could be either way round on the two adjacent ports.

ports.JPG

ports2.JPG

Final thought, when Elanscan interfaces fail to connect its worth double checking that the program is pointed to the correct Comm port by checking which comm port is identified in Windows Device Manager and then setting that in ElanScans Setup pulldown menu. (If you need more on this DM me and I'll try to give more detail). If you can get Elanscan running, fresh plots may help this along.

Good luck

Edit - Could the CO pot be a culprit for rich mixture? Open loop SE owners might be able to advise.

[roj]

No base timing has been attempted due to lack of timing light and I’ve never done it before. Willing to learn though. I knew it was part of the process in the setting up but a step I hadn’t got to yet. Have placed an order for a light.

I knew of the port on the back of the plenum. There is a bung on there. However, I haven’t checked it. Will do so.

Regards ElanScan, I knew about all the port settings, etc. I’d say I.T is more my bag than car mechanics. There seems to be no rhyme or reason with it. I’ve changed port numbers, tried the lead in different USB slots, rebooted the computer, turned the car on and off again, unplugged and replugged the lead, changed the latency time (set to 1 again).

Just another heads up, I did have a tinker with the idle throttle screw (made a note of where it currently sits at). In service mode, I wound the screw all the way in and the idle did come down a bit but way too high above the magic 950rpm. It may have been 1500rpm at its lowest point.

Just to confirm, I see with base settings, it’s wind the screw all the way in and back it off 1.5 turns. So if we’re talking degrees, we’re talking 540 degrees (360 + 180).

I think it’s battle ElanScan again as until that’s running properly again, we can’t see what the car is doing.

Will go and see if I’ve got enough pocket money for a timing light.

Thanks again for your help.

[Saltire]

WRT ElanScan: I don’t know which version of Windows you’re running, but there have been documented problems with ES on Win10/11. This thread refers. Paging RonR

Hope this helps!

[dapinky]

The 'easiest' way to see if there is a vacuum leak in the system is to purposely introduce one and see if the engine idle changes momentarily whilst the car tries to compensate for it. Simply removing any vacuum pipe whilst idling *should* cause the engine to hunt a bit for the right settings .... if there is no change, then there is already a leak somewhere, but if it changes, then it is a good indication that the vacuum is 'sealed'.

Of course, knowing there is a leak isn't the same as finding the leak, but it is a quick and easy check to perform instead of looking for something which may not be there.

[roj]

Running Win 11 on brand new laptop with the very latest version of ElanScan to cope with Win 11 (I believe). I'm more inclined to focus on my cable at the moment as it's the major variable (as in a poor connection may stop the flow of comms). Currently working on a V2 cable. Fingers crossed.

[roj]

Update time.

Have ElanScan back up and running. With my new Mk2 cable constructed, I discovered it still didn't work! After many many attempts, it appears that it could be a dodgy connection when plugging into the car. The pins in the connector (car side) may possibly be offset with use and are failing to make the connection.

Anyhoo, I've been able to go for another run and collect data.

Start up from cold and a drive (initially to run at 30mph to reset the IAC valve). Idles high and can drive itself. As it warms up then the idle does come down.

Back home and perform a few tests where possible with vacuum pipes. The only ones that didn't seem to make a difference were the pipe that exits the throttle body and goes to the unit on the passenger arch side (EGR vacuum solenoid valve). Like wise the same pipe that attached to it.

Tried the same trick again that TorqueHorse mentioned of rolling my thumb over the intake hole within the throttle body. Sure enough, this brought the revs down to below 1000rpm. Release my thumb and it goes back up to 1500rpm. This is after replacing the IAC valve and cleaning the throttle body. Looking at my recent data, the IAC valve starts high at 80 but then eventually comes down to 25-30 over time.

I think throttle position sensor and voltages look okay.

Only thing yet to do is check timing. Bit stuck for time (excuse the pun) but it is on my radar.

No error codes shown (after paperclip test) following this drive.

Last thing is possible hissing around the front, near the turbo. Not really noticed it before and couldn't decide if it was a hiss or not. I've shot a video and uploaded to here:

https://youtube.com/shorts/0RxYKFCGPAo?feature=share

Do watch till the end as the possible hiss is caught then.

I also attach latest data.

Thanks in advance to anyone who can steer me in the right direction.

Cheers, Rog.

[Tuga2112]

has anyone mentioned about the screw on top of the throtle body that is intended to adjust the amount of air flow for the idle ?

i dont know if you tried this already but..

1 - start the car in service mode (paper clip trick) let it warm up and keep an eye on the revs
2 -tighten the screw, do 1/4 turn at the time.
3 - check revs.
keep track of how many turns your doing

repeate 2 and 3 until it drops to jsut below 1k when idle

if you not seen any difference after 4 full turns put it back.

[roj]

Hi Tuga.

Yep, tried the idle valve and no real change in revs.

However, my latest line of enquiry is the PCV valve. Just happened to spot in the service notes that a stuck PCV valve could result in a high idle speed. After my attempts to remove the valve, the damn thing broke off (verty brittle). This has resulted in me having to take the cam cover off to recover any debris. A new PCV gasket and valve is on order but looks like 3 weeks to turn up. There appears to be similar valves online to purchase but I'd rather get one from a reputable source (SJ).

If you go on YouTube, there's tons of videos on PCV valves and the consequences of them not working correctly. Such as:

• High Idle / Erratic Idle / Stalling
• Incorrect fuel settings - too rich / too lean
• Oil leaks due to the pressure forcing oil out of gaskets (interestingly I've had an oil spot on the floor)

So looks like I can tick those three off. Fingers crossed this sorts it. Will update this post when I get it all back together.

[Tuga2112]

interesting problem to have with a pcb valve.

mine came apart in 2 pieces jsut a few weks ago.
it was very obvious there was a air leak in there.

i reassembled the whole thing. pushed the 2 halfs together in the vice and used some electrical tape to keep them together... been ok for 200 miles so far... in fact add another 4 as i gone out to the pub for lunch in the office just 2 hours ago

[roj]

So after a few weeks absence for one reason or another, I’ve now fitted a new PCV valve. No change…..Doh! Still worth doing I feel as the new one sits more tighter with no movement whereas the previous was loose. Start the car up, sat at 2000rpm and off I go for a drive to get up to temp. Get home, now idles at 1400-1500rpm.

Turn the car off, disconnect IAC valve, start the car up, jumps to 3000rpm (I assume as it remains in the open position). Turn off, reconnect IAC valve, turn ignition on, turn off for 10 secs, turn back on and start. Car idles again at 1500rpm. So to me that proves IAC is working (should be, it’s a new one).

Had a tinker with the idle screw valve. I can turn it all the way in until it stops and it still doesn’t bring the idle down (only slight).

I’ve yet to do base timing (before anyone mentions).

I had a good listen and I’m not sure if there is a hissing around by the turbo. Could this be where extra air is getting in? The turbo appears to be working fine on a drive. Picks up nicely, no lag or anything.

Any thoughts on a leaky pipe to the turbo? If possible?

As always, thanks for any input.

[Tuga2112]

Had a tinker with the idle screw valve. I can turn it all the way in until it stops and it still doesn’t bring the idle down (only slight).

that adjustment needs to be done with the car in service mode.

I had a good listen and I’m not sure if there is a hissing around by the turbo. Could this be where extra air is getting in?

Any thoughts on a leaky pipe to the turbo? If possible?

does not sound liekly to me. the turbo increases the intake pressure. a leak in that area would be more likely to display lack of power on high-full throtle

have you checked the vacum hoses that go to the secondary throtle ?

I Just found out in my NA the one feeding to the small reservoir was not attached, i could hear a leak just barely and it was a matter of checking everything until i came across that one.
im currently waiting for new pipes before trying again and hopefully getting that resolved.

[dapinky]

As Joao says, idle needs to be adjusted in service mode....... the reason being that the ECU 'assumes' that it was set to 950rpm in service mode, even though it is 1500 (or whatever), so if you try to adjust the idle screw, the ECU will think something is wrong, and do it's magic to keep it at 950 (except it's really 1500).

Service mode takes all the other sensors out of the equation, and allows the screw to adjust the by-pass of air to get the idle correct.

[roj]

So bit of an update on this thread. Still not fixed but have invested in a smoke/pressure machine. I have discovered a leak (or so I think I have). I currently have air coming out of the throttle edge port on the throttle body (see attached pic). I've never ever seen a pipe on this since I've owned this car. I believe this is only used for Catalyst Cars only and I think mine is not catalyst as it only has the EGR vaccum solenoid and is missing the EECS.

Now I flagged this port earlier in this thread when I was cleaning the throttle body. I noticed the insert in this pipe. This is where the air is coming from. Should this be blocked off as it 'should' be unused?

Can anyone confirm this / shed light. Car is a 1990 Turbo SE.

Thanks in advance.

[roj]

I may have answered it. Just seen a pic of a throttle body on ebay and could make out a bung. Anyone confirm a bung should be there please?

[Tuga2112]

i will have a look at my car to compare and let you know.

without wanting to go off topic to much . my NA has a air leak which has been a absolute pig to find (i have swapped all pipes i can think of without going inside the car (heater matrix ones) without any luck

your too far to borrow the tool, any advise is welcome

[roj]

I’ve plugged the pipe up. Pretty sure it should be closed off. Just tried running the car again but still high. Just resetting the ECU.

The smoke machine can be found here:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/PLAYOCCAR-Smok ... B0D9M54LWT

[roj]

So……reset the ECU but no difference. Tried more smoke. Could be a possible Exhaust Gas Recirculation valve! Not unless it’s supposed to be open with teh engine off.

Vid here showing machine and smoke coming out of said valve.

https://youtu.be/pqL93kB2ngc?feature=shared

[roj]

After some more reading on here about EGR valves I stumbled upon this thread.

viewtopic.php?f=36&t=28398

I noticed that TorqueHorse suggested pressure testing the EGR valve. Just tried it. Apply pressure and I can feel the diaphram move upwards and hold. Release the pressure and the diaphram moves down. That to me would indicate the diaphram is okay.

[Tuga2112]

since your grasping at strtaws, (and its too late for me to fully read the thread) have you tested the MAP sensor ?

start car. and unplug the vacum tube from the map sensor. see if theres any diffenrece.
the sensor shoudl have a vacum reading. and then start reading atmosferic pressure. if you cap the vacum tube with your thumb. the vacum in the engine is the same. but the MAP will read high and the ECU adjust acordingly.

if the removal of the vacum pipe doesnt cause a change in the revs. you may find the sensor to be faulty. just a thought